[AI] Horrible experience with AI, whats wrong?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by gkz, Aug 11, 2013.

  1. gkz

    gkz Registered

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    Hallo,

    after months of frustration with that regard i finally need to post here, as i just cant find any entries about this on the internet.
    I always race with a friend on LAN and we fill the field with AI cars.

    No matter what car or which tracks (ISI, mod community) it's always the same. The AI drives every corner of the track like super slow, making big breaks at the apex of corners even though they drive already like 20-50km/h to slow on average, then accelerating like hell out of the corner where they leave you with absolute no chance at all. Its like they have no traction and weight at all.

    Further it seems like the car that is in front of the field always slows it down on purpose, creating big traffic even after many rounds of racing. What the heck is this? This is the most annoying thing of all we experience.

    On the contrary if you pass them they sometimes chase you like rabbits on cocaine with no regard of saftey what so ever, crashing you out of the way, driving like nothing happend and leaving you on the sideroad spinning.


    We tested it offline in single player with the same results. We tried to modify the config of the hoster and changed AI Limiter to 0 (from 1) with no change what so ever to the behaviour. We just cant have a normal race with the AI.

    Is there any way to fix the problems with the AI we having? I'm really surprised to have not found anything alike about the AI by other users. If i find something, they just tell how freaking great the AI in this game is, but i've never seen it (although i see potential for the best AI ever, still)...

    Thanks for reading
     
  2. MarcG

    MarcG Member

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    what specific mod and tracks are you using?
     
  3. gkz

    gkz Registered

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    As i stated before: "No matter what car or which tracks"
    We tried many combinations: C6R,Megane Trophy,F1/F2 cars,BES Mod on Croft,Palm Beach,Nordschleife,Silverstone and so on.

    Always the same, the filed gets stuck behind the first one who slows everything down as much as possible.
    Most obvious was a race with a C6R on palm beach where i crashed, was about half the track behind, manage to come close and then they started to speed up again until they "have to" let me come close again to start that pattern over and over again.

    Also "AI Strenth" changes did nothing at all.
     
  4. MarcG

    MarcG Member

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    I suggest a full reinstall then as I've had nothing but fun with the Meganes, C6R and Camaros at Mills and Palm Beach recently and have seen no problems of which you describe.
    AI Strength does work with the AI so there is something wrong your end, maybe you've messed up some files or altered AI settings in your PLR too much. Try a default PLR before a reinstall just incase, also it helps to run a Qualifying period with the AI as slower cars will hold up the field at the front if you just skip straight to race.
     
  5. gkz

    gkz Registered

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    The funny thing is we didnt change anything on the configs but the AI Limiter as we are not very familiar with all of this. It also happened that in the last 5 months both of us installed the game from scratch about 2-3 times. I remember also that the first time we load the game up after we purchased it and drove the ClioCup it was already like described above.

    I just dont get it.
     
  6. MarcG

    MarcG Member

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    Well all I can recommend then is another fresh install, as you say in your first post you're surprised by not finding anything related to this so for me it's defintaley something your end.
    ClioCup worked perfectly out of the box for me personally, I remember running dozens of races at Mills with them and no problems whatsoever.


    This thread helps with explaining the finer points of the settings in more detail:
    http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.php/12831-The-definitive-AI-Settings-Thread?highlight=
     
  7. MarcG

    MarcG Member

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    when you say Strength does'nt work, you are reloading the track right? as changing it whilst at the track has no effect. In an older build it would work if you restarted the weekend but that does'nt work anymore in recent builds (unfortunatley)
     
  8. gkz

    gkz Registered

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    Yes, always started new race.

    Is there a possibility that AI is broken on LAN matches? We always drive on LAN together against AI.
     
  9. MarcG

    MarcG Member

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    did'nt think LAN was possible in RF2 or did I dream that?! the AI work fine on online races from what I've seen.
     
  10. gkz

    gkz Registered

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    Yes, but you still have to join over the multiplayer function.
    My friend always hosts a LAN server over the"host" button, does all the settings, then i join and we race.
     
  11. TJones

    TJones Registered

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    I also encountered somewhat similar problems with AI, but not that whorse. Often they drive slower then necessary at the apex, but only about 5 km/h, than with a very strong exit. One example might be last corner before the long straight at Mid-Ohio, they always get a very good exit there, making them realy hard to catch on the straight.
    One other problem i found is a strange AI behavior, sometimes they slow down if you get very close to them in corners, in such cases they reduce speed alot, sometimes up to 30 km/h. In result you get under attack by the car behind again, can be very frustrating. ;)

    gkz can you describe a specific situation where your problem encounters at most, to reproduce it. Mod, track, AI settings, maybe specific corner?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 11, 2013
  12. YoNiS

    YoNiS Registered

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    Hi gkz

    IA should not drive like that, obviously you have some kind of problem.

    Last friday i joined a server with F1RFT Demo and IA was driving as you has described, i don't know if he had same problem as you or there is something not working on the mod demo.

    I will suggest you to try this things:
    -First try IA in single mode, both of you, each one on his computer.
    -Second change your roles, if you friend is always hosting, and you are usually the client, this time try being the server and your friend being the client.
    -If any of those don't work, then make a new install in a different directory, so you won't mess your current installation, and immediately after install try a single mode (on the new installation) with IA again.

    Keep us updated.

    Regards
     
  13. Hedlund_90

    Hedlund_90 Registered

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    AI's drives like sh*t, that's nothing new. For me, it's impossible to race against them. When racing them one by one, they can be quite good, but as soon as they get into close racing they slow down and drives really bad. The car in front of you can in a middle of a corner suddenly decide to drive half as fast as he could, resulting in you crashing into his rear and spin out. They can be fast sometimes, and suddenly slow down.

    A problem that has always been: AI ahead of you drives extremely slow and bad, but the cars behind you drives much faster. As soon as you get past this slow AI, he suddenly drives much faster again. Most often I have no time to react and crash into his rear when he slow down, or I manage to brake, resulting in the very quick AI behind me trying to overtake me very dangerously and crash us both out...

    I think these guys that are happy with the AI as they are now, have very low expectations OR they drive some car/track combos that works very well (And that's not the 60's F1, that's for sure ;))

    I have done many fresh installs, and installed on completely new system, and I see no difference.
     
  14. DurgeDriven

    DurgeDriven Banned

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    wots AI :confused:


    :D


    AI is a precursor for self-harm.

    Why waste what precious life you got driving with crash test dummies.

    You can do that in my room !


    lopl
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 11, 2013
  15. baronesbc

    baronesbc Registered

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    potentially the AI could be the best ever, it has very realistic attitudes, but it only works when you are 1 vs 1 with it, and in practice or qualify session:

    in race is terrible, you can try different combinations, tracks, mod, difficult, no matter, the AI in the group becomes very slow and for me it's impossible to race, very irritating..
    with the historical f1 then it's even worse, the times from the practice session to the race, rise of several seconds.. too boring and irritating.. for example, at historic monza, with the brabham, AI set to 120%, in practice and in qualify they do 1.30.2 or similar.. i can do the same times and start in the first positions, with the prospective for a good and close race.. it's not, in race they become very slow, two corners and i lose them.. instead if you start in the middle of the group, it is a certain crash
     
  16. Fabio Pittol

    Fabio Pittol Registered

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    What you guys said regarding racing 1 AI and racing a pack of cars is totally true.

    Also, what makes a huge difference is how the AIW of the track is done. At Mid-Ohio, for example, they are insanely slower than you at Turn 1. It's fair to say the kinda compensate that on the other turns, but is weird. I lost count of how many times I forgot that and smashed an AI's rear end.
     
  17. YoNiS

    YoNiS Registered

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    I did not agree with what you were saying, so i decided to make some test.
    I didn't play much with IA, but i did some when i bought rf2, and i didn't remember them so bad...

    I have try this configuration:
    -Formula ISI, on malaysia, 17 IAs, 27 laps race, on their first laps they did 1.40
    -F1RFT, on hungaroring, 17 IAs, 27 laps race, on their first laps they did 1.29 (same car and track where on friday in other server IA was so stupid and slow)

    They were gentle but really fast, and their behaviour did not change from when i was in front to when i was behind.

    So, or you have a problem on your system, or you don't have a good IA configuration. They are not perfect, but they do the job.

    In reference of what gkz sed, if i change for example AI Limiter to 0 they stop waiting each other and they start making small groups or even going alone instead of one big group.
     
  18. LabR4t

    LabR4t Registered

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    Two line's in .PLR file may help, make sure you closed rf2.

    AI Limiter="0.00000" // Range: 0.0 (no limiting) - 1.0 (limiting used to make racing closer but also make more driver differences on flat-out tracks)
    AI Mistakes="0.00000" // a range of (intentional) AI mistakes from 0.0 (none) to 1.0 (sometimes). Anything above 1.0 multiplies the frequency
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 13, 2013
  19. MarcG

    MarcG Member

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    Sure there are issues with the AI and I'm sure MikeZ is only too aware of these as I know for a fact he keeps an eye on AI related threads (see link below), so my advice is to simply find the right balance of a good Mod and Track (remember AIW plays a massive part too) and pretend the AI are Humans who make mistakes and maybe slower at certain points on a track.
    If they bunch up too much for you then lower the number of AI or fiddle with the Limiter value, if they keep making slight errors at a certain corner then Calibrate them for that track and they *might* be better at that spot, if they consistently ram you from behind then *maybe* it's your braking point being too early (seen this alot!), if they are simply poor at a track then *maybe* it's the AIW of the track...not a direct result of the AI.

    Try this combo which is currently my fave and one of which I've found no issues:
    Track - Mills Inner Loop C
    Mod - Camaro, Megane & 370z
    Remember to *always* run a qualifying session, bunching up problems can exist because people skip straight to race and therefore slower cars/AI drivers are at the front (common sense!)

    The definitive AI Settings Thread
    http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.php/12831-The-definitive-AI-Settings-Thread?highlight=



    I've said it before and I'll say it again, I think the problem is some people are looking for complete perfection from the AI so the smallest little thing is majorly wrong in their eyes, god knows Humans are not perfect every single race....even the greats made mistakes!
     

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