2023 Q2 Build Update and Hot-Fix

Roninho said:
I have a question about this. I just did a 90 minutes race with the idt champcar mod on the Laguna Seca laserscanned track.
AI works great, good fighting, no stupid crashes, etc.

Just one main issue and that is the AI that is about to be lapped is impossible to overtake for other AI, and very very difficult for me to overtake. The AI actually defends the position, for example when i try to make the pass in the last corner (before s/f straight) the ai actively tries to block the inside line. And when you pass they actively try to repass you.

As a result the fastest AI is behind an about to be lapped car for over 10 laps, and obviously loses a lot of time. This kills all the immersion.

I will test it at other tracks (especially since Laguna is a b*tch to overtake anyway) but what is a possible workaround to make this playable? Any settings to adjust in the player (or other) files?
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This is something that I observed during testing as well, and it is unfortunate to see. The 'AI Aggression' setting needs to have more of an impact for the AI.

As it stands right now, if a faster car in the same class is about to overtake a slower vehicle, it can sometimes take several laps to pass (track dependant). Sometimes it cannot even pass at all, even on occasions where it has almost taken over the vehicle but then pulls out last second due to the path narrowing.

The game definitely has the logic for overtaking, it is one of the best in the business. The aggression settings just need to be adjusted to allow for those at higher aggression levels to bypass certain boundary parameters. I have observed so many times faster cars going for overtakes and being ahead of the car, but due to the corner narrowing, they just drop back and given the position away when it makes no sense to do so.

If this can be tuned, it would be another welcome change.
 
Hi Pales, are there any settings you suggest to use to improve this?
I am testing with the draftstickyness setting in the track aiw file and first results are that it seems that lowering this at least substantially reduced the nr of laps it took the leader to pass a backmarker.

At the moment i have a 25% aggresion setting for the AI, so i guess i could test a combination of lower draftstickyness and higher aggression.
 
Roninho said:
Hi Pales, are there any settings you suggest to use to improve this?
I am testing with the draftstickyness setting in the track aiw file and first results are that it seems that lowering this at least substantially reduced the nr of laps it took the leader to pass a backmarker.

At the moment i have a 25% aggresion setting for the AI, so i guess i could test a combination of lower draftstickyness and higher aggression.
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I doubt you are a novice as you doing full races.

80% strength = 20% agro ( Novice)
100% Strength = 40% agro ( Advanced )
120% Strength = 80% agro (Alien )

Higher the agro more decisive the AI pass each other I find.

My best advice is to stick to the combos you are fastest at.
 
Thanks. It depends per track but i'm between 90 & 100 strength, so i will update the agro settings.

I am a bit worried about the AI being very aggresive towards me, but i will simply test it.

Anyone got input on if the slowwhenpushed setting in the aiw file might help at improving ai overtaking? And if so increase or decrease it?
 
@Roninho the major (only? not sure) effect of aggressiveness is how far alongside they need to be, before committing to a pass. So if their aggression is very low, they're much more likely to pull out* of a passing attempt, while if aggression is very high they'll keep going for a pass even if they're barely alongside the car in front.

*giggity
 
Small update: I have tested at laguna laserscan 1.3 with 50% aggression, slowwhenpushed of 0.0 and aidraftstickeness of 2.0.
This was 25% - 0.0 & 4.0.
I also added the draftstickynessmulti = 90 line to the rcd file just in case it might help.

In the old situation the leader could not lap a backmarker in 10+ laps.
In the new situation the leader takes between a lap and 3 laps to lap a backmarker, so that is improved and playable.

The general overtaking in the race left something to be desired though. Laguna Seca is an extremely tough place to pass, i cannot make an easy pass myself. So i will test it also at other tracks that i would see as medium and high passing opportunity tracks (Portland & Road America for example).
 
Roninho said:
Thanks. It depends per track but i'm between 90 & 100 strength, so i will update the agro settings.

I am a bit worried about the AI being very aggresive towards me, but i will simply test it.

Anyone got input on if the slowwhenpushed setting in the aiw file might help at improving ai overtaking? And if so increase or decrease it?
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You are correct worrying, rF2 is so dynamic even the interaction between 2 AI can hinge on a small bump and change from one lap to the next.
You also correct that not all car and track combos respond the same they can be radically different. rF2 you have to find what suits you, it's hard work but I believe will be rewarded with persistence.
Nothing in life worth doing is easy.
Figuring out what works for you, putting it all into practice in long races with pitstops is the most rewarding experience I have ever had in sim racing bar none and by a good way. Again you got to remember a race won't unfold like in other sim. Well for me at least races in AC ACC AMS2 are very predictable you know how the AI will behave lap after lap.
rF2 you just never know what a AI will do, like in real life drivers have brain fades all the time.
rF2 they made the same car and AI have various levels of behavior so they can appear more as individuals rather then robotic.
This is the biggest thing racing rF2 you simply can't rest you have to plan each pass or you will crash and blame bad AI.
You see that is what makes it so dynamic, warts and all. imho
 
Roninho said:
Not sure if that is the reason. Maybe mistakes in the talent file.
But i just did a 90 minutes race with a mod that has talent files (that work, the guys supposed to be fast are fast, the slow ones are slow). And no issues in practice, qualifying and race. No strange crashes, everyone setting a fast lap in quali etc.
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Thatswhy I mentioned "wierd" talent files as being the culprit. I am sure if you configure them the right way you can still have decent racing. But if they aren't configured the right way, the result is a big mess wich wasn't such a big problem before the AI updates. You just need one AI dude not being on the top of his game and it's game over. So atleast the recent AI updates seem to amplify issues with bad talent files. I remember spending quite a bit of time tweaking the talent files for the Group C community update but I haven't really checked and compared if the mod works better without them. Got to check that once I have a bit more time again. ;)
 
Yeah i understand @hitm4k3r , i raced the 96 f1 mod, the 05 champcar mod and the 07 f1 mod. All 3 have talent files & didnt cause the issue you had, so hopefully it isnt an issue that happens a lot.
 
best example for a bad talent file is Flat6 Series rF2 build 7.00 from Enduracers
 
To be honest worst example imo was when S397 put paid content/cars/mods online without an rcd/talent file. I think i had this with the indycar mod
 
Manfredk2 said:
best example for a bad talent file is Flat6 Series rF2 build 7.00 from Enduracers
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I don't race against AI, so i don't follow all News about AI related Things, but haven't there been some Changes in the Talent Files, so that older Ones may not work properly anymore?
 
Afair i was already a problem when v6.00 came out and this was in 2020.

Maybe the aggression values in the rcd is the problem. Afair it was 90 or above. Sadly never tested it by myself with lower aggression values in the rcd
 
Drogo said:
A really massive thank you to Devin and the team for these AI updates, I have had some of the best offline racing in rF2 for a very, very long time thanks to you guys. I run 105-115 difficulty, 85 aggression and 0 limiter, flags on full and I've encountered zero problems so far, no rear ending me, no turning in on me unless it was an obvious dive bomb (one of the things that irks me about those youtube videos that spend the whole race dive bombing then calls the AI rubbish) and no unnecessary or endless safety cars. 25 mins BTCC at Croft left me with nothing but pure joy, I was either attacking or being attacked the whole race, about 5 mins from the end I put a wheel on the grass, recovered the car without spinning or anything but went from 8th to 14th in a nano flash, I just had to laugh with myself in excitement and the feeling of, OK!! So we driving,driving.... OK!! lol!! Once again thank you S397.
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Has the AI changed within the last couple of months because now it's back to the crash fest of previous.
After my last post I spent a couple months racing without a doubt the best AI of any title, It was seriously good!! Now the problems of past are back and it's been a waste of 3 days trying to get some kind of race going, now every single race ends with the AI crashing into me, every one!!
The AI's ability to legitimately defend is the key factor that stood out in rF2 compared to all the others, ACC is too predictable and too slow, I'll now try AMS2 and Raceroom after their updates to see if something is workable, I was really looking forward to some serious seat time but it's a shame I wasted half my holidays messing with rF2.
 
Drogo said:
Has the AI changed within the last couple of months because now it's back to the crash fest of previous.
After my last post I spent a couple months racing without a doubt the best AI of any title, It was seriously good!! Now the problems of past are back and it's been a waste of 3 days trying to get some kind of race going, now every single race ends with the AI crashing into me, every one!!
The AI's ability to legitimately defend is the key factor that stood out in rF2 compared to all the others, ACC is too predictable and too slow, I'll now try AMS2 and Raceroom after their updates to see if something is workable, I was really looking forward to some serious seat time but it's a shame I wasted half my holidays messing with rF2.
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Dont worry, its as allways, one step forward and two steps back
 
Drogo said:
Has the AI changed within the last couple of months because now it's back to the crash fest of previous.
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I don't know what you were talking about "best offline racing experience"... As for my opinion rF2 AI were always inclined to crash and ram player's car. and the faster and more powerful the car is, the more this tendency increases. for example, racing F1 mods with AI is almost unplayable, because almost every such race ends in an accident because of AI and I have to press the “race restart” button over and over again. I'm thinking of making a new video about how rF2 AI stupidly rams my car for no reason
 
When reporting AI issues, it's important to state which track and cars are being used because they're an integral part of the AI. Also, reporting in an appropriate forum and in its own thread would help keep track I guess.
 
Bernat said:
When reporting AI issues, it's important to state which track and cars are being used because they're an integral part of the AI. Also, reporting in an appropriate forum and in its own thread would help keep track I guess.
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I've reported that Croft is still unsuable for any race with pitstops as the cars on the grid straight crash into the cars leaving the pits. I've reported this in the appropriate thread/s, still unusable even though its bought and paid for, if id have known this before buying I would have done what I did with Circuit Azur, and not brought it till it was fixed. Took years for Circuit Azurs A.I. problem to be fixed, and when it was I brought it. Im glad it got fixed but, I should'nt have to not be able to use it after paying for it over a year ago now!
 
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