CSW or T500RS

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by williang83, Apr 5, 2014.

  1. antgen

    antgen Registered

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    A little off topic but maybe someone is interested
    Amazon.co.uk has T500rs at it's lowest price (310 GBP) http://www.amazon.co.uk/Thrustmaster-T500-Force-Wheel-Feedback/dp/B004GNG2MW?SubscriptionId=AKIAJ7T5BOVUVRD2EFYQ&tag=camelhometrackeddeals-21&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B004GNG2MW

    http://uk.camelcamelcamel.com/Thrus...ctive=price_amazon&context=home_tracked_deals

    So if someone from Europe wanted a T500, I think at that price there's no competition.
    Usually the price drop is lasting for few hours till a couple days.
     
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  2. Murtaya

    Murtaya Registered

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    DrR1pper yes by forced cooling I meant a fan but I don't think it will be required for the reasons I surmised. Maybe a 40mm fan on the fets of the speed controller, but I would not expect the motor to get hot at all be it in or out-runner. An out-runner of similar power is cheaper than an in-runner version (usually) they are also available in lower kv higher torque versions than in-runners, you can even buy them in kit form, change the windings. It's a generalization but I think iit's worth investigating from a diy wheel pov as they are easier to work on and modify.
    Why couldn't we measure the force being exerted by the driver as current from the motor? I suppose we could it would need a plugin at the very least I guess probably more, I assume the bodnar wheel is capable of this (measuring force exerted by driver) but it won't be implemented until new software, maybe Reizas next thing? If you owned one you would hope one day all that overkill now, would one day reap even more benefits than you get from owning one now. Still resisting..... just.
     
  3. ice_magnum

    ice_magnum Registered

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    Yes it has some cost, nonetheless, you spend money on exactly what you want, modding wheel and base from the beginning to the end.
     
  4. ice_magnum

    ice_magnum Registered

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    Yes but i ve seen T500 price dropped to that range of price.
    Very good but i am still expecting more about T500, base sounds very powerful and good but i definitely prefer Fanatec wheel over Thrustmaster, especially F1 rim.
    While F1 Ferrari Add-on feels like a toy, Fanatec Formula Rim looks good and according each review, as smooth as light (btw i had CSW+ F1 rim that i sold to a nice iRacer guy)
     
  5. antgen

    antgen Registered

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  6. DrR1pper

    DrR1pper Registered

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    You know the funny thing about that is...."If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck" was applied here when i decided to buy the csr-elite over the t500 thinking not only would it ergonomically feel better (with the slight strip of alcantara on the rim) but that it must perform significantly better in FFB with it's cool looking open glass peering base unit exposing the power unit like on a super car (exactly like the csw's), it just looked the business compared to the t500 and the significant price difference only served to solidify that impression/prejudice of mine. How wrong i was....in short, i was suckered! :p

    No regrets though....had i bought the t500 first, i would have been plagued with the thought of "wow, ffb already feels amazing, imagine how much better it could be if i bought the csr-elite instead." And i'm grateful it was plagued with repetitive motor issues that drove me to finally buy a t500 instead and in being able to be one of the few people out there who has truly compared them side-by-side.
     
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  7. ice_magnum

    ice_magnum Registered

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    so basically when using lower FFB settings, T500RS feels more ''heavier'' with more resistance around the center?
     
  8. DrR1pper

    DrR1pper Registered

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    More so than the csr-elite did for sure, i remember the csr-elite felt like it had zero resistance. But as backwards and counter intuitive as this sounds, this is actually a pro rather than a con for the t500. For some reason, the t500 feels more stable and confident in those lighter ffb moments (equivalent to lowering the ffb). I'd understand if all you read from me was the the t500 had more resistance and stopped there to make your judgement that the t500 must not be as good but it honestly makes it better. Very difficult to explain why it's better and difficult to convey how non artificial that benefit feels.

    I'm sure there's a technically explanation for why that's so but i'm unable to figure out exactly why atm. Btw, you don't feel/notice this resistance when driving at all. If i had to bridge an analogy, it sort of like having a mechanical STM (steering torque minimum applied to the wheel) which is great as the ffb doesn't disappear on you like it does on the csr-elite did in those lighter ffb moments. In terms of feeling, there difference was remarkable for catching snap oversteers and made driving on the grass without spinning all the time completely possible on the t500.

    It's truly a shame that these things can only be conveyed to others via word of mouth of ones experience.
     
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  9. ice_magnum

    ice_magnum Registered

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    I own CSW and race on F1 cars.
    Basically with full FF at maximum, i have great immersive feeling but being slower about lap times.
    Under 50-60 FF, i feel like none resistance at all.
    I use 100 FF from wheel and around 70 in-game and adjusting artificial effects whether i need to
    I woulds try T500 for sure but i love so much Fanatec F1 rim.
    I am stuck lol
     
  10. DrR1pper

    DrR1pper Registered

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    Yeah and I completely understand why, CSW rims look absolutely gorgeous and I bet they feel like they're worth many times it's value.

    The csr-elite rim is not to the same standard as those of the CSW and I wish I could try a CSW myself too. I was hesitant to buy the t500 also for the quality look of their rims. However, to my pleasant surprise they are not as bad as they look but I must confess that the ergonomic feel of the csr-elite is better than the t500's to me (but the 458 rim is still very nice, feels extremely solidly built and the non-static shifters feel amazing...way better than csr-elites even). More importantly, I came to realise how much better the ffb was on the t500, so much so that I've come to realise (at least for myself) that the feel/look of the rims are of no consequence if the ffb feel is much better as this is ultimately the largest proportion of the wheel experience in the end.

    I vividly remember after trying the t500 for the first time thinking (and saying to Smithaz on Skype) that this wheel was a complete steal for the price it's retails at and that thustmaster should be charging something more in the range of £1000 if i were to compare it's performance and performance to my csr-elite wheel. There was and still is in my mind no competition between these wheels when it comes to the ffb experience. Remember that when i purchased the t500, i was able to return it for a full refund within 7 working days and so i felt ok with taking a chance and buying it to try it for myself with the intention of returning it as i really thought it was going to perform worse....to my astonishment, the complete and utter opposite.

    Again, I've never tried a csw but I've argued that the csw uses the exact same base unit (more importantly exact same motors) as the csr-elite and to the best of my knowledge, research and counter research by those who have opposed my position, all evidence seems to confirm this to be true.
     
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  11. ice_magnum

    ice_magnum Registered

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    For instance, with F1-rim, CSW gives very great performance, maybe sightly above T500
    Are you using T500 with CSP V2 or stock T500 pedals?
    I would hear a nice comparison of these pedals as well
     
  12. DrR1pper

    DrR1pper Registered

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    hmm, not sure why you would think this. If you're implying because the F1 wheel is lighter thus has lower moment of inertia and is thus less damped in feel vs the BMW rim, then yes i can understand that as being true. However, the csr-elite rim is even lighter and made almost completely out of plastic with even smaller moment of inertia and yet it was no match for the t500. So, granted that the two wheels (csw and csr-elite) truly use the same motors, wheel base and that the force/torque output are the same on each, I can't see this as being true from my own experience.

    edit: if you meant the feel/experience of the wheel rim....then i would say for sure! Most likely leaps and bounds better than any of the t500 rims.

    I have CSP V2's. Though i have not tried the stock pedals, never bothered to take them out the box. But i've been thinking about it and i want to try them in the inverted format, just to see what they're like. But i can't till the end/start of June/July.
     
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