[REL] EnduranceRacingX EGT by URD Update V2 July 2016!

Discussion in 'Vehicles' started by UnitedRacingDesign, Apr 4, 2013.

  1. GTClub_wajdi

    GTClub_wajdi Registered

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    lol.... from this video it seems that the car has more grip in the wet than some ISI GT car on the dry!
     
  2. baked bean

    baked bean Registered

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    Really, your doing something wrong then mate. ;):D
     
  3. FONismo

    FONismo Registered

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    If you watch closely and read info, the track is greasy, i.e drying from wet, where he slides is on the wet patches. It's also if reading the info is correct his first time at the track and first laps. I'm talking really about officially prepared GT3 machines, someone that knows the track well and can attack 100% not some guy that has a love for racing on a track day.

    Btw that track looks awesome, i have never seen it. Ultra cool elevation changes!

    Look at the difference between that damp lap and the full on wet driving of Sean Edwards in a proper cup car that has be tuned to the max for that given track. Look at the confidence and grip Sean has in his car in comparison in the wet! Never mind the dry, although you can see him attacking in dry on previous page.

    Yep i agree
     
  4. tjc

    tjc Registered

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    Two good videos Nismo...

    Great driving by Sean Edwards and very sad news about him too. Another talented young guy gone...

    Second video really shows what a challenge these cars are in the wet, he`s constantly sawing at the wheel. Good stuff.
     
  5. Slamfunk3

    Slamfunk3 Registered

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    A video of a rear engined 911 cup car can be a little misleading when we're dealing with gt2/GTE cars. I agree that these cars should be fairly easy to drive, however I don't think the ISI Corvette is "wrong". I actually think the car understeers a bit which in turn makes people apply more steering input and that combined with rapid throttle input is what causes the slow speed spinouts.
    As far as driver aids go the gt2/GTE cars are not allowed ABS but they do allow throttle-cut TC. That is perfectly simulated in rf2, even the HDV file for the Vette has no aid penalty for using TC. IMO it should always b used however it won't make u faster, its not supposed to.
    Ales you've been doing great with the progression of these cars. With the lap times these cars achieve being close to they're real life counterparts the physics can't be too far off. Maybe the ballance between aero and mechanical grip is a little off but thats gonna b a tough one. With "feel" being such a subjective thing I doubt we'll ever all agree. Keep doing what u are. Its working, at least for me, and getting better all the time.
     
  6. FONismo

    FONismo Registered

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    Yep that's the point mate, i expect to saw at wheel of classic beasts dry or wet and i love it, it's why it's my favoured form of sim racing, they are the most rewarding, they were basic back then. But i also love modern GT but don't like how you have to piss around with the rF2 cars in the slow stuff, they offer no confidence in the slow stuff and i get way too many wtf moments with them.

    When i lose it with classics, i know why. With modern GT cars i'm always like wtf??? Too much like the bad stuff in rF1
     
  7. baked bean

    baked bean Registered

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    Lol at its like driving in the rain comments.


    Dont seem that way to me.
     
  8. Mibrandt

    Mibrandt Registered

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    I very much agree about the different aids. If the car have ABS and traction control irl it should of course also be like that in the simulator. No race driver in the World would turn off eg his ABS breaks to make it more difficult for him self and feel macho :D
     
  9. FONismo

    FONismo Registered

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    I'm wondering if because you drive from the rear seats you have a different opinion. You should try sitting in driver seat sometime :D I see the same kind of throttle application here in your driving in the dry as i see in wet Edwards video. I can see the same nervous nous to your driving on corners as i get with them ( GTR and Camaro ), your not pushing whatsoever.
     
  10. baked bean

    baked bean Registered

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    no i not pushing hard all the time as theres traffic and im no pro also, im just countering the rain argument you see. My seat is fine where it is, if i look right in the pits when i look at another car's driver's bonce it seems about right, i dont have a low fov as i use trackir with single monitor.

    Before i got Trackir. not the best lap, but not like driving in the rain.

     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 15, 2013
  11. flitzi

    flitzi Registered

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    ok, great to hear that some of us can agree on the 370Z having a nice balance.

    I really don't wan't to diss this mod, Ales, I wish you all the best and hope you are successful with it. For the record, I'd easily pay 10 bucks for a well done mod, and GT cars are my favorite.

    As I said, I haven't even driven the EnduRX cars yet, I was afraid I wouldn't like the handling, like with the DTM car, and some comments here seemed to confirm that your definition of a balanced car is more on the tight side (you call it stable, ok, sounds better, but is still the same for me). People defending your work came in and threw the word "realistic" around, and said ISI cars don't have enough "grip". That's where I wanted to chime in.

    I think at this stage of simulation physics there is not realsitic or unrealistic. I'm sure you can build a car irl that handles like the URD and ISI cars, so both are realistic.
    On a green track I agree, ISI cars don't have enough grip. But apart from that, how do you explain that laptimes and top speeds are very close to real life when the cars have not enough grip?

    I have a feeling that "not enough grip" is most often describing "having problems with oversteer". And there comes the demand for an understeery car. Well, all I can say is, if you really want to race that thing you will want to dial that understeer out and create a more balanced setup to get faster. This means that everyone that was happy at first with the understeery setup now is a lot slower than the guy who created a balanced setup. Making a balanced setup more stable is fairly easy, but turning an understeery car into a balanced car is much more difficult, or sometime even impossible without turning it into an twitchy beast. That's why I'm so allergic to understeery cars.

    I think 60% of the problems people are having with ISI cars is due to green track, 35% due to wrong driving style, throwing the car into the corner with a lot of trail braking and expecting to be able to always catch the car, and 5% because the setups are more oversteery than most people are used to. I like ISI's approach of delivering a balanced and competitive setup for their cars!

    After all, less understeer isn't more realistic, but it's definitely faster :)

    Cheers
     
  12. UnitedRacingDesign

    UnitedRacingDesign Registered

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    @flitzi there will be a free corvette 2013 model from us that you can try and yes we wont use the ISI physics from vette as whole, the base will be taken but the base is allready used for others to.

    Some good videos on Tommy Milner chanel from corvette 2012 onboard http://www.youtube.com/user/tgmilner/videos Nice and smooth drivers and there are alot of hotlaps from trainings or races even. And one more thing you should know how much grip those cars have. Have anybody ever noticed that GTE cars can keep up and even overtake LMPC cars when its not on topspeed tracks and those cars are 900kg with allmost 450hp.
     
  13. FONismo

    FONismo Registered

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    I don't believe in this green track stuff any longer, i thought that had something to do with it a while back. But even rubbered in, some cars feels weird as hell still. Also the Mak Corp open wheelers have sensational tyre/grip feel from the get go. It's nothing to do with green track anymore for me at all, it's car and tyre physics of that said car being setup that way.

    I'm really interested to drive the BTCC car. I read a post from Tim a while back and it sounded great, he said it was a proper race car in feel. Driving style doesn't come into it for me, i can switches styles to suit each kind of car quickly. I can drive every rF2 car fast, doesn't mean some of those are not funky.
     
  14. baked bean

    baked bean Registered

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    I think the Japanese super touring GTR will be interesting also when it comes being a high down force type too.
     
  15. flitzi

    flitzi Registered

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    I watch a lot of ALMS. LMPC are amateur drivers, right? Anyway yes, on a slow turn where aero isn't playing a role a GT car can be faster.

    About those videos: sure it looks easy sometimes, they are damn good at what they, that's why they are pros. Do I need to post videos of "when I went wrong" ? I don't think so.
    I'm not sure what those videos are trying to prove, sure a race car can be driven around, and driving smooth was and always will be the fastest way around, that's why they do it. But you can do the exact same thing in the ISI C6R, or not? Well, I can, at least. I think the biggest problem when people aren't able to drive as good as the pro on youtube isn't the lack of talent, it's the lack of g-forces/seat of the pants feeling, 25fps and wrong FOV. Some things can be overcome easily, others need some practice...
     
  16. N3R0

    N3R0 Registered

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    Do you mean Super GT Series? Would be great if you would consider adding the Subaru BRZ GT300 - my favourite race car *-*
     
  17. flitzi

    flitzi Registered

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    You shouldn't "believe" it, you should give it a try, really ;-)
    No srsly, the difference in grip between green track and rubbered track is too big imho, but that's a different topic. If you don't like some of the ISI cars, well, everyone has his/her own opinion, and I like most of the cars and don't think it's necessary to make something different to make it better. Especially not making the car understeery as hell! But that's just my opinion, and I now leave it at that.
    See you on track!
     
  18. FONismo

    FONismo Registered

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    Hmm possibly you missed the point or you're reading what you only want to read from the post. I am not dismissing Real Road, in fact when it's finished and works as intended it will be fantastic. You said that you feel 60% of problems people have, you feel are Real Road related, i feel and what i posted is that it's maybe not a Real Road problem as the Mak Corp cars feel great from the get go.

    I originally also felt that Real Road may have been a problem as was giving the wrong impression of cars. When in fact now i don't believe it does and that it's cars physics and tyres themselves that determines a good or weird feel. FFB is possibly the culprit who knows. All i know is the Mak mod has a great feeling of tyres and the road and can feel the difference in wheel instantly.

    Only person i see mentioning understeer in this thread is you, no one else is asking for it????

    I'm asking for a car that feels like a car and not like i'm skating on an ice rink in the slow speed stuff.

    I would like also Ales and ISI to implement real life assists into any car that uses them in real life and force them. Nobody is asking for fudging of physics like you seem to think but rather they want realism to the sim cars. That means as said already if a real life car is using ABS then the sim version should also, not sure where understeer has come from???
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 15, 2013
  19. Slamfunk3

    Slamfunk3 Registered

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    Just as a note for the guys that like to look at videos to see how a car should handle. Look up videos of guys like Seth Nieman, Tracy Krohn, Rob Kaufmann and even Michael Waltrip.
     
  20. UnitedRacingDesign

    UnitedRacingDesign Registered

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    Im not saying on the corners where grip doesnt mather but overall, except there is straight topspeed the cars take easy on that. How much of amateur those drivers do you think they actually are? I really doubt they are so slow that they couldnt put a 900kg grippy basicly LMP limited car around the corner faster than GT if that would be posibile. This are cars beeing driven by profesinals but that doesnt make them supermans that they would actually go ahead and fight every single round with the car on 2-3 hours drive.
    I mean lets really look deeply around, why are most of regulations usually happening? Becase its simply that cars are getting to fast at corners allready and this has happened in the past and still happens that evolution of a 4 year old car like the vette since 2009 and now at 2013 it should be a completly diferent car in driving style so as more comfortable, stable and grippy one as only this stuff to get the driver to feel good and get good laps is why they push the technology. Its same as new model would come in all those years, usually changes as i mentioned and big changes are done yearly, even if you dont see that from outside.
    Dont get me wrong but i do follow all those races and we have even seen that many cars have far more downforce that some might think as another example are supergt cars where there are custom build fully downforced cars posibile but still gt cars can handle them to. :)
    Im not saying ther wont be anymore updates on those cars but the main physics for front and rear engined car stay as it is, here and there for sure we will addjust more stuff, update tires and more.

    Ah and one more thing ive noticed while back on ISI vette that the car uses far smaller front tires to, all this affects the physics to. Ive tested once ISI vette complete physics with suspension on our bayro but ive added 2012 tires provided by ISI and there was mayor diferente to as for one the tire itself is diferent and second is the tire diameter affects the physics alot plus there is diferent wheelbase to.
     

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