Jeremy Miller tweets (Senior Programmer at ISI)

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by TIG_green, Feb 21, 2013.

  1. Alesi

    Alesi Registered

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    so long to wait... its already 1+ month and still no update..(
     
  2. coops

    coops Banned

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    who knows who cares get it when we get it or you will be disappointed or bored of waiting as there is never a release date given.
     
  3. Adrianstealth

    Adrianstealth Registered

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    A nice juicy build the week before Xmas would be nice

    With some nice updates & optimisations yummy,

    Gosh it dosnt seem like a year ago since we had that last xmas
     
  4. Bart S

    Bart S Member

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    Its too hard to resist and not ask, can we expect to be testing a new build soon like within a couple of weeks?
    The last build was/is totally brilliant, please keep up the impressive improvements with graphics, little improvements with graphics with every release keeps everybody happy and has a greater impact on the publics confidence in the product. I say this cos for most of us a mix of graphics and performance improvements always makes us play more because we appreciate more these things. We all know you want to add more features but most of us already appreciate how featureful this product is already, with every new build adding a feature together with a gfx visual or performance improvement is always going to look great in the public eye. This will keep your established buyers / players online and playing more often which is better than what I think happened a few builds previously, you gained a few but lost a few all down to graphics and performance neglect.

    Have a nice day and give me some good news please :)
     
  5. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Well in my humble opinion a lot of us would be even happier if the graphics and performance stayed exactly the same next build but we had realistic-rate (or configurable rate) realroad/weather effects, configurable weather per session including warmup, position and lapcounts that didn't screw up under safety car, an end to some crazy collisions that happen online, the known issue of moveable objects turning solid being fixed, wet groove effects on the tyres, KERS (even a simple implementation), and probably some others I can't think of right now. Another graphics step does absolutely nothing for racing.
     
  6. Saro

    Saro Registered

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    The best features underneath aren't worth much without a smoothly running graphics frontend. So I say keep improving both! :)
     
  7. coops

    coops Banned

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    agree with lazza 100%.... IMHO more graphics is nice but this sim needs a lot of things completed and implemented as with certain things missing or not finished league racing is no better or worse than RF1. That is what this sim is about for most ppl (ONLINE RACING IN A LEAGUE). As the pick up servers are very new to rfactor.
     
  8. vittorio

    vittorio Registered

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    rF2 is a race simulation!

    With an improved rain model and realistic timescaled RealRoad rF2 would be able to simulate a 24h Nordschleife race (my biggest dream to do in a race simulator). Physics and FFB are IMO already the best and driving rF2 with an Oculus Rift shows how realistic this piece of software is. Driving at night at pleclair's Nordschleife with a Rift in rF2 totally feels like driving at night! Only rain and realistic timescaled RealRoad is missing.

    Of course, graphics improvements and optimizations to reduce input lag are always welcome. Realistic clutch model would be important too.

    Anyway, the simracing future will be awesome!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 4, 2013
  9. Dhurara

    Dhurara Registered

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    @vittorio
    Totally agree with you!
     
  10. John.Persson

    John.Persson Registered

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    I look forward to an 24h race!

    More realistic stuff please!
     
  11. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Yeah, of course without the ability to have smooth graphics it's difficult to enjoy playing it (and while we could have smoother graphics using the rF1 engine there's no doubt it helps when it looks better as well); but that's why I said 'next build' - just a single build concentrating on some of the more fundamental stuff (and to be honest, half of what I've listed above a work experience kid could get working just by modifying some existing code) would get us to a point where we can race properly and happily wait while the graphics and audio etc are worked on :)

    In the last FAQ Tim (I think) made a comment that he can't see any reason why a league can't race with rF2 already - and he's right, but apart from the tyre physics and FFB pretty much every rF2 exclusive feature has a caveat. Been running rF2 league races for a year now and while we're using features like realroad and rain everyone's still having to accept that it's not all quite right. Intermediate tyres are a complete waste of time. Weather, even server-side random weather using a custom prog to generate it, lacks surprise because warmup doesn't have its own weather, and lacks continuity because you can't separately configure each session (all practices are the same; all qualifying sessions are the same; etc). Watch pretty much any real life wet race and they all adopt the 'wet line' because the racing groove is more slippery - but in rF2 it doesn't happen.

    A lot of what is there is undoubtedly great, and I'm sure when it's all 'finished' it'll be fantastic, but sometimes I wish we could just delay getting 20% closer to perfection for a build and get stuff working, more simply than the ultimate goal, so we can use it properly.
     
  12. Bart S

    Bart S Member

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    To be honest Lazza another graphics step up in the antialiasing of track markings can make the racing alot better, the difference SGSS makes compared to the current highest level in game alone is easily noticable. The difference is clarity at what your looking at in the distance, for me if they nail this I will not ask for more, this is detail a sim racing game needs. For example since switching to the new build I've had to drop my SGSS and go along with in game settings, they have vastly improved and are much better but still not as good in the clarity deparment so obviously more can still be done. I am running in 3D mode at max settings at 1920x1080 on a maxed out GTX 780 and 4770k, I'm sorry but IMHO I know we can get more from rf2 in FPS department as well as visual quality compare to the standard of other upcoming sims.
    I don't suggest ISI stop feature updates I mearly suggest it would be good they are released with a small gfx update performance or visual quality wise each time a new build is released. Clarity is everything in sim racing, your perception, reactions and control inputs are all based of what you see it is a very important part of racing.
     
  13. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Yes, but if it looks completely realistic (I mean photorealistic; perfection we'll probably never get to) and you still can't use inters because the track gets wet and dry too quickly, or you don't need to use the traditional wet racing line because the groove is still giving you more grip even in the wet, it sucks as a racing sim.

    I fully agree any improvement is good, and if it continues to look better and perform better then great.
     
  14. coops

    coops Banned

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    graphics.. I want realistic looking not eye candy that looks fake.
    compared to other sims what sims have a engine as good and the features rf2 is saying it has? none so how do you expect FPS and QUALITY to be like other sims.
    comparisons are crap when no 2 sims are alike and have same features and engines.
     
  15. Noel Hibbard

    Noel Hibbard Registered

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    I agree with Lazza, the graphics in it's current state isn't a deal breaker for leagues but the other problems he lists are. Luckily the devs working on the GFX work independent from the ones working on the stuff that is critical to leagues. I guess the GFX devs could be temporarily repurposed though.
     
  16. UnitedRacingDesign

    UnitedRacingDesign Registered

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    I think GFX and other game features are done by one guy. The 3d/2d art team is independent. Overall game coding and with this including GFX is one guy if im not wrong.
     
  17. Noel Hibbard

    Noel Hibbard Registered

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    My understanding is they all move around a little but Joe is the main GFX guy. And yes art is independent.
     
  18. Bart S

    Bart S Member

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    Going back to my original post that started all this I think a few of you miss read what I was inclining.
    I don't expect features to stop for my satisfaction of graphics improvements, I just say a little bit of gfx or performance(fps) be added with every build or feature.
    Yeah I'm a graphics guy and most of what I go on about will most probably be something to do with the visual aspect of the game so I'm just mentioning what I think is important. If infact Noel and Ales is right about there being just the one guy working soley on the graphics (Joe) then regardless of working on features(other devs) graphics development never stops at no point will it detract time from the development of features. Infact I hope what I say here Joe will read and work on what I still see as a bit of an issue.

    More to my point then... I want to give you a little senario of what happened to me and why I say a little more work with graphics especially AA is important it does make or break a race.
    I was in a very competative fight for first place in a race at Brianza, the speed we was traveling was very high, I just come out of the parabolica turn in the BT20 and my opponent was shadowing me in my draft. While I was keeping an eye out on what he was doing looking back quickly then forward I couldnt quite tell what I was approaching I knew it was something in the road but I refused to adjust my fast line to give an inch of distance not knowing what it was. Well it ended in disaster for me as it turned out to be one of them white posts, I could only tell what it was when it was too late. In real life I would of been able to make a much better judgment call of what to do because clarity of the post would of been much better from a further distance, perharps better AA and occulsion would of really helped here, I also race with an FOV of 24/26 so I can see better further than the default view and things are still a little too unclear.

    Now I dont wanna blow my own trumpet but I am a pretty good racer all round in rF2 I have alot of experience and time on it, so while you guys also make valid important points about the direction of the game and priority I dont think you should be critical of my suggestions it just becomes provocative rather than constructive. This forum is here to help ISI make the game what we all want it to be.

    I dont recall mention anything to do with fake eye candy effects that is unless AA is a fake eye candy effect.
    Just look at what was acheived with the last build and its graphic enhancement, compared to previous build are you saying that it no more can be done?
    I think its reasonable to expect FPS and Quality to be like other sims and yes I think we can get way more it just either hasnt been worked on yet or not refined in the code due to other priorities, if cpu processing was on 4 cores rather than 2 dont you think fps would improve? What about SLI and getting that to work, will that not make graphics rendering faster, I'd go out and get another GTX780 when they get to that part unless the GTX880 is out first. As an experience C++ programmer I can tell you theres a million ways to write a program to do the same thing, optimisation and speed comes from writing efficently and thats down to the individuals talent and knowledge. I bet theres so much stuff in rF2 that written quick and dirty(slow unoptimised) for now just to get things in so yeah I expect many more fps top be found in future.
     
  19. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    I knew I was probably taking your post out of context, since you didn't actually say nothing else was important and that's the slant I probably gave it. But graphics gets a lot of airtime already - each build there's a discussion on performance, how it looks, etc. All the core gameplay issues get stuck in the wishlist section (because they aren't really bugs) and feel a bit left out. So while you were concentrating on graphics and saying 'most of us' would be happy if more graphics and performance improvements are made (which of course is true), I just wanted to throw it out there that there's plenty of other stuff we'd also like to see.

    I don't know how the team is structured and who's doing what, but I'd still contend that some of the issues I've listed above would be a quick fix.
     
  20. Ronnie

    Ronnie Registered

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    Jeremy Miller said:
    "After fighting with the our Hypervisor that host our build "machines" last week, builds are building and should be out to testers tonight."
     

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