FIA GT3 by Apex Modding Team(WIP)

Discussion in 'Vehicles' started by GTClub_wajdi, Oct 8, 2012.

  1. Jamezinho

    Jamezinho Registered

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    Completely agree. Very well said.
     
  2. Davy TASB

    Davy TASB Registered

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    If this line of text from a quality modding group don't set the alarm bells ringing at ISI, then nothing will.
     
  3. Johannes Rojola

    Johannes Rojola Registered

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    I can't describe myself as quality modder like Apex, but I agree with them with the mod development. It is frustrating with rF2. It was pretty okay with rF1 considering that the game came out in 2005. But its been 8 years now, times have changed. I really like the approach AC has taken on modding, sure I can't say last words before I actually try that out but everything so far seems that it has pretty darn good modding support.
     
  4. Noel Hibbard

    Noel Hibbard Registered

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    Please explain what makes you so sure that modding will be better with AC? Simply because they say so? They haven't released much detail so far. All these new titles with massively more complex tire models are going to be a challenge. I personally find it alarming if AC's tire model is as simple as plugging in a few details. If it is that easy it is basically a canned tire. We can essentially do that today in rF2 by taking an ISI tire and making a few tweaks.

    rF2 will be just fine in the long run. The fact is rF2 is the only modern sim that has any 3rd party cars at all. So currently it is ahead of the game. ;)
     
  5. wgeuze

    wgeuze Registered

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    I've noticed the same a while back as well. Untill they release stuff we won't know how modding will be for AC. Also, it appears people want to mod for these new generation sims but don't have the patience or passion that goes with it. rF1 times are clearly over and in every way people need to step up their game, that is called progress.
     
  6. Johannes Rojola

    Johannes Rojola Registered

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    Actually they have released information about that, but I am sorry I can't find the source right away. I'll get back to this when I find it :)
     
  7. Adrianstealth

    Adrianstealth Registered

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    Nooooo! Not something else )-:

    Is ISI working on this ??
    (To make rf2 more mod maker friendly ? )

    Kind of very important when I think about it
     
  8. Rik

    Rik Registered

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    agree.
     
  9. GCCRacer

    GCCRacer Banned

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    Isn't there the basic risk that business models based on previous software then fall flat? I.e., if it turns out that the majority of modders are overwhelmed with the depth of next-gen racing sims, then the idea to release a title with only a few official items and the mod crowd to fill in the rest will fail.

    AC will have many more "factory" cars included at release, so maybe they will have a bunch more default tires...
     
  10. pas74

    pas74 Registered

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    and what does it mean actually?? they have hypercars in their list they never SEEN and most of important never DRIVEN in reality? please??
    they really tested a pagani zonda r, a ferrari p 4/5, a mclaren mp4 12c gt3...???where they gets those different tires values??
    from the newspaper ??

    If apex doesn't want to develope this gt3 mod for some strange reason...it doesen't mean nothing to me ...for sure another modder team will take care of it.... :)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 8, 2013
  11. Rik

    Rik Registered

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    no strange reason.

    only greater technical knowledge. modding is not for everyone and everything.

    this is a big step forward for RF2. only model of high technical quality or anything. i love this selection!
     
  12. wgeuze

    wgeuze Registered

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    rF2 has made leaps forward compared to the stock rF1 content. If the current trend continues, we will have a AAA base vehicle for almost every major class of racing as a complete package. If this isn't enough to provide modders with what they need, including documentation obviously, nothing will, expect for actual real world data, which some moms-basement-type-modders will never get in the first place. Even professionals are lucky to get this kind of data, and sometimes even this data is altered in ways to mask some stuff.
    rF2 has how many great cars now?
    Technological advancement comes at a price. People stuck in rF1 ways or techniques will have to advance or as Apex modding team have done, realize they don't want to continue with rF2 for now at this point. Mind you, those guys can get loads of content done still while in the meantime learning how to deal with rF2 or any other engine. They never said they did a shift-delete on the project ;)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 8, 2013
  13. pas74

    pas74 Registered

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    agree

    non male Rik...;)
     
  14. fanlebowski

    fanlebowski Registered

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    hey guys

    we still test rf2. and if we'll have a nice car to look and to drive, we'll release it ;)

    i would like add that there are others parameters than the game itself, or the tire model.

    for example, will be usefull today to release 1 or 2 cars ? or will we work on our cars to see massive conversions in few weeks ?

    At the beginning we started the mp4 for rf2 and AC, and with the AC model, hum, ... situation is different ;)

    Anyway, this days we work on cars we like, and as said, we'll release them on rf2 if it's nice to play. but we don't want announce a mod as we are not sure ;)
     
  15. GCCRacer

    GCCRacer Banned

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    Wgeuze, you are kind of making my point for me. If the data needed and the technical knowledge is so sky-high, then how can modern sim titles expect to have their car ranks fleshed out by private effort?

    It is a bit of irony that the same kind of driving realism (better tires, road, physics) which we appreciate about the product seem to prevent the "content realism" (proper cars on proper tracks under proper ruleset of real world series).

    Realism in a racing title for me means both... to have a life-like driving experience as far as physics go, but also life-like in terms of what and where. Maybe there's a point now were increased detail on the former will see the developers themself having to do more of the later.
     
  16. Guy Moulton

    Guy Moulton Registered

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    Because the grass is always greener on the other side :rolleyes:

    If AC's tire model is so much easier to make for modders, then it's going to be a lesser tire model and I want no part of it. Plus AC will have no rain. Modding groups are going to have to change and evolve to mod for rF2. If they can't- then they should stick with rFactor1 and leave rFactor2 to the new groups that are coming up. It's going to be tough to mod for rF2 and groups are going to have to add a member to their teams- a tire guy.

    Apex isn't convince by rF2? I'm not convinced by Apex TBH.
     
  17. fanlebowski

    fanlebowski Registered

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    ^^ you right on this point

    hum... it's easy to say this. moreover you can see by yourself how the official content of rf2 change this last months. so don't think this is an excuse.

    can you explain why something more simple to use is necessary worse ? or wich arguments do you have to say that the ISI way is perfect and so nobody can do better ?

    if you already did a nice tgm for rf2 i'll happy to drive it :)
     
  18. KernigWRC

    KernigWRC Registered

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    I would recommend to release every car as component.
    So its easier to update and when every car is final you can release all cars in one mod.
    Like ISI is doing it with their cars and tracks.

    As I told you, I really like the rF1 physics so I would like a simple conversion of the rF1 Mod with ISI tires.
    Later you can update the tire models with the camaro if they are suitable and update the 3D models.
    High qualitiy in early stage of developement isnt low quality.

    I write that here to hear the opinions of others about that.
     
  19. wgeuze

    wgeuze Registered

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    Professionally created content will always be more accurate simply because of the resources available. How some mod teams can think they can do better with made up data than ISI who worked with teams (how close are loosely that may be interpreted ;) )is simply so arrogant it is beyond me. The problem we reach now though, I think, is that the differences become more obvious. For example, the changes in the feel of car with a different setup. The FISI can be turned into a different car almost with a different setup. Those same differences could be seen in made up data and actual real life data, it could be enough to have a very different feel and behavior of the car. And yes, even if it is just some suspension values etc.

    Mind you, this is nothing new, only now ISI is starting to build quality content themselves with actual data in collaboration in one way or another with teams and/or engineers.

    You just can't make all that stuff up and expect it to be accurate, really, just, no. Same with laser scanned tracks vs google maps referenced tracks. There is just no way. You can get very close though, as seen with Lime Rock and Silverstone which are great examples, but it wouldn't surprise me if they had some GPS recording data after surveying the track at their disposal as well. The same thing applies to cars, the more data you have, the less difficult it is to build the car up to spec. Notice my choice of words, less difficult, it might not be rocket science, but if you don't know what you are doing, it sure can be.
     
  20. fanlebowski

    fanlebowski Registered

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    for the debate ;)

    you have to know that we make the physics and 3d support for a GP2 team. and so even with a good partnership and a big team who want to have the best simulator as possible, it's impossible for us to have more detailed datas on tyres as rf2 needs.

    basically ATM, even if you consider the TGM model finished, and it's not, you have to put not a race engineer, but a tire engineer who works for the brand you want simulate and the coder in charge of tires for ISI in the same room during 2 weeks.

    without this, yeah you'll be able to make the tire geometry, "translate" some parameters from the pacejka model and adapt others after some ingame tests. but i don't see, in anyway, how you can make a tgm without 80% of empirical method.
     

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