FIA Formula Two Williams JPH1B Released

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by 88mphTim, Sep 11, 2012.

  1. Digi Lauda

    Digi Lauda Registered

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    I can give you one more example what feels logical, just for another person :)

    http://isiforums.net/f/attachment.php?attachmentid=3940&d=1347557864

    It is from this thread:
    http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.php/7645-wheel-weight-g25

    There is no real sense of posting this, it´s just to show what different kind of preferences people can have.

    It doesn´t make things easier, for the gamers and developers..............

    digi
     
  2. Digi Lauda

    Digi Lauda Registered

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    Has anyone tried to drive the F2 in heavy rain, let´s say in Palm Beach? (simple weather - raining)

    What are your impressions in wet conditions?
     
  3. jtbo

    jtbo Registered

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    There is know issue that in wet conditions car is too slippery, so I have not dared to even attempt driving on wet.
     
  4. buddhatree

    buddhatree Registered

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  5. tjc

    tjc Registered

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    Did give it a quick try one night but it was quite impossible really...

    I mean I expected it to be difficult but it really was like driving on ice. Maybe with a bit more time a decent(ish) lap could be achieved but it would take lots of patience.

    Glad to hear this is going to be worked on though... :)
     
  6. Digi Lauda

    Digi Lauda Registered

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    Oh,

    thx! Somehow i missed or forgot it.
    Ok, i believe that it is correct what they believe :)

    You have more controll in a barrel going over the Niagara Falls :rolleyes:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 17, 2012
  7. Saabjock

    Saabjock Registered

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    Anybody else losing wheel feel sensation in turns with this car? The steering goes really light in turns for me. I'm not getting any of the feedback chatter I've normally received during karting with understeer or the sudden tug you get when transitioning from under to oversteer. I've run several laps at Palm Beach only to test. It feels great on the straights. I must admit that I'm testing all the cars with default settings only since I want to get that sorted before tweaking any other settings.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 17, 2012
  8. Gearjammer

    Gearjammer Registered

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    Have you tried the car on any other tracks? Perhaps it is just the track that is causing the light feel?
     
  9. Saabjock

    Saabjock Registered

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    No Gear...I haven't tried it on any other track yet.
     
  10. Digi Lauda

    Digi Lauda Registered

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    You can try to turn on spring and damper effects (not Center Spring!) That gives you more feeling of "resistance".
    But in general the car is understeering very much with the default setup. When the car is slipping over the front wheels (no grip) the steering goes light (probably too light on this car).
     
  11. Tuttle

    Tuttle Technical Art Director - Env Lead

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    This problem has been reported a lot of times in this thread and Tim said they're looking into it.
     
  12. whiplash

    whiplash Registered

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    I did a couple of runs in the f2 now, and damn is this thing hard to drive! But not much else as i expect a turbocharged singleseater to be. What makes it really hard for me to drive fast AND consistant, is the lack of low speed feeling. As much others have reported already, it only affects the ffb on low speed driving, on higher speeds it feels just brilliant. I have driven a few raceprepped cars (not single seaters though) and can not believe that a racing driver would be satisfied with such dull feedback at low speeds. I work as a mechanic, so i am aware of different angles affecting the steering rack forces, but never ever would an engineer set a car with powersteering up in a way, it turns itself into the corner. It's just not necessary.

    I have a fanatec gt3rs v1, and this is the first car i did try to change the ffb-setting from damping to friction, and i could feel quit a change. But sadly, what becomes better at low speed gets lost otherwise. Can anyone explain me what exactly this setting (damping or friction, 0 or 1 in the controllers.ini) does?

    Keep that excellent work on ISI! And i'm off to practice (1.06 at palmbeach... normally not THAT slow... :D )

    ... and yes i am aware this has reported already, but wanted to tell that there are more with this issue!
     
  13. ThomasH

    ThomasH Registered

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    try to up the FFB multipler in controls (as suggested earlier)
     
  14. Saabjock

    Saabjock Registered

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    Sorry, I hadn't followed any of the previous post or read any of the previous replies prior to posting my comment. I'm not complaining as much as stating an observation after doing the laps. I'm sure they'll get it sorted out at ISI.
     
  15. whiplash

    whiplash Registered

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    trust me i've done pretty much every tweak to make it feel better, but on low speeds it just does not feel right for me. period. and running more than 1.20 multi on my fanatec might well destroy my desk... :D and i don't understand why i have to set my controller.ini totally different for every single car (like in rf1...), it should at least be similar for every one. and this worked so far, only the f2 seems off to me, altough i haven't driven the FISI alot.
     
  16. krivjur

    krivjur Registered

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    When thinking about clipping you can ignore the bumps, most of time they're just rapid jolts, you don't need to feel the magnitude difference in them and they clip the output with almost any reasonable multiplier. Tested Mills InnerLoop C, even with 1.00 FFB multi the feel is pretty dead with CSW GT rim (unfortunately) 540 deg, 20.7 lock on car. Only time you get some feel of weight is on the few faster corners with bumps on them.

    I'm mostly interested in feeling what the car is doing, not just bumps. I did find 1.00 multi wasn't enough even on the Formula rim when I used faster ratio (400-430 deg with 20.7 lock). This is mostly regarding the default set. If you decrease the front camber you can get more weightier feel, maybe toe would help as well.


    There's somekind of canned resistance you can use (default Steering resistance coefficient="0.10000" on presets I checked). The damping method is something you should have control with your wheel drivers or settings (eg. you could override it to 0). With friction, it probably just depends how each wheel's driver / firmware how well it's handled.

    http://doc.51windows.net/directx9_sdk/input/using/forcefeedback/effectconditions.htm
    If I use that as a guide, I'd say friction is static force fighting against you, defined by the coefficient in the controller.ini. Damping works in similar way but the fighting force depends on your speed of steering.

    I haven't tested how this works in practice with rF2 however.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 17, 2012
  17. Tuttle

    Tuttle Technical Art Director - Env Lead

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    Totally agree with you. Tweaking the Controller.ini and/or pushing on the FFB multiplier just to put more force in a single FFB hole is a non-sense, especially if your wheel was working correctly since now. :)

    Imho there is something wrong in the car physics, and the fact the F2 driver was saying everything is ok doesn't mean there're no errors, especially if he's using super-strong-solid FFB pro hardware. ;)
     
  18. whiplash

    whiplash Registered

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    That's why we all would love precise information about the hardware they're using! :D

    @krivjur thanks for the explonation, seems logical to me. thats why it doesn't feel too wrong if i use friction as steering resistance type, but a lot of feedback isn't transferred because its overlapped by some static forces.
     
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  19. jtbo

    jtbo Registered

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    http://theamazoeffect.blogspot.fi/2011/03/vector-w8-twin-turbo.html

    In article it says that car has almost no centering effect which makes it difficult to be smooth until one gets used to it, now that is car capable of 0.97g and over 200mph, article also says how slide is surprisingly easy to control for a such vehicle. So there is no feel from the wheel but still surprisingly easy to control, but you have to learn to control without feeling from the wheel.

    Now that is pretty much also what I have found with Formula 2, but I do get lot of feel from the wheel, only when I turn too much things go bit dead, but I have driven real cars that has the same, so it really comes to how one drives, how one grips the wheel etc.

    Sure I can have pretty dead wheel if I squeeze it, but I use palm and thumbs mostly, I can feel everything that way and G25 is not enough strong to pull wheel from my hands.

    Well at least I can't explain it other way how those using G25 would have wheel without any feel at all.
    Maybe driver can cause that kind of difference? My driver is only 5 years young, 5.01.256, as it works so well I'm not going to upgrade...

    Changes I made to controller.ini have also changed other cars to be so much better, it is like if before friction of tires would of not been felt, but something else, now I feel how when braking tire starts to lock up, so I don't need to rely only to visual cues.
     
  20. call-911

    call-911 Registered

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    This could be very true especially if the F2 testers are not used to what rF2 is capable of. He may just had been astounded by what he was seeing at the moment with experiencing how great it looked and felt relative to whatever other sim or game (if any) he had used before.
     

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