Anyone else concerned about MSG’s future?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by jamesleegte, Apr 4, 2022.

  1. AMillward

    AMillward Registered

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    I’m not making fun of you. I was only stating that the job of those “hacks” was to entertain and they’re most likely not going to give you what you want..

    I also suggested that the best way to get the content you desire is to make it yourself. It’s worked for Barry Rowland, he’s at 100k subscribers now and his stuff is the most niche stuff out there. Nobody else is taking apart a £1,500 wheel rim.
     
  2. green serpent

    green serpent Registered

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    Probably a bit too harsh... most of these "content creators" are decent, I'm more talking about the kind of guys who shit all over certain sims without even playing them, or use certain sims to gain a cult following then try to create some huge drama because they discover that when the physics engine is pushed to the extreme it's not a 1:1 representation of real life. Hey, at the end of the day I'm probably just jelly that these guys can make a living off sim racing even though they're vapid as hell. Anyway, moving on.
     
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  3. memoNo1

    memoNo1 Registered

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    I didn't take it that way either.
    Really not.
     
  4. AMillward

    AMillward Registered

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    Well, it wasn’t the intention and if did come across that way I can only apologise.
     
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  5. memoNo1

    memoNo1 Registered

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    No, honest constructive criticism is the best there is!
    Honestly.
    But again, what would you like to see or hear?
    That interests me. .
     
  6. FERNANDO CABRERA

    FERNANDO CABRERA Registered

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    So if MSG sunk do it takes rfactor2 with it...
    Errrr... No, simply look at RBR...
    What it will happen is that rfactor2 stops evolving.
    Some people are echoing that rfactor2 get archived and create rfactor3. But what they don't see is that the rfactor2 from today is quite different from the original rfactor2.
    Codemasters could have milked their community many years of the same sim engine to reach the level of evolution we have in rfactor2 in it life span
    What worries me is actually that MSG takes that approach, and start creating a new sim that have immersive sound engine, or implements me realistic PBR material handling, or updates it graphics engine to dx11, or improve the tire physics to improve the accuracy of the contract patch...
    I really really really what them to succeeded whit using rfactor2 engine gmotor to power their own game... Evolve the engine, and subside it with dlc (that sooner or later i will buy) and leave it as an open engine, so us mod creators can continue learn how to create models, physics, material handling, applying splatter maps and learn new techs.
    I don't worry that rfactor2 goes the way of the dodo... What worries me is that it gets closed and MSG starts charging for a new version that's brings the same that a new patch/Q drop brings simply to milk more money from it.
     
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  7. FAlonso

    FAlonso Registered

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    the worrying thing is to see that nobody speaks, Marcel has just left and nothing is known, this is really not normal. Stefano left Kunos and from that same day it was known that ACC would continue to develop, it seems incredible to me that there is not a single word in this case, I think I have not seen anything like it.
     
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  8. hitm4k3r

    hitm4k3r Registered

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    Marcel said, that the Studio and devlopment is in capable hands. That leaves a lot of room for speculation but I think it would be cool if people maybe just chilled the f*ck out and wait what happens before anyone jumps to fast conclusions. :p

    Anyway, what's a bit annoying is this whole over exagerated drama. MSG might haven taken more gum than they can chew and they published a game that was released too early, but it might be worth to sometimes check the actual state and quality of their whole product line. And in that sense their last releases and content offerings especialy for rF2 have been outstanding from my POV. Everybody goes crazy about the price of the DLCs and what ever crosses their minds, but having spend the whole day with the new tracks and cars, the quality is really exceptional that I would go that far to call especialy the tracks industry leading. And such quality costs money obviously. If they can refine the whole IMSA, Indycar and BTCC stuff together with the game I see no reason why rF2 shouldn't have more time left, even when MSG failes. It looks good, it sounds good and it feels good. what else do you wanna have as a sim racer?
     
  9. green serpent

    green serpent Registered

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    (sorry for off-topic)

    IDK if this question was directed at me specifically (because your post was in response to my post) or if it is just a general question...

    What I personally would like to see (which is not really within the scope of possibility for guys like us), is more direct comparisons to the sim car and it's real life counter part with a series of standardized tests. Not just lap times, but actual tests set up in a fairly controlled enviroment such as a skid pad, that demonstrates the exact behaviour of the car in certain scenarios. Such a thing would be difficult to do and probably would not yield much usefull information unless it was done to an extrememly exact standard.

    An example of one such test in real life is the "Moose test", where a car has to negotiate a very sharp right/left manouver to see if it rolls over or not - again the test must be very standadized so the comparisons between cars are valid. It fasinated me that the best car ever to complete this test was not some hot hatch or mid-engined sports car, but a Citreon Xantia (FWD family car).

    I find "testing the integrity" of something rather entertaining. One of my favorite shows growing up was Mythbusters, and I could see this hypothetical show being somewhat similar to that format (test something to see if it works, and then if it does not, what needs to happen to "replicate the results").

    As far as you personally - I think just keep doing whatever you feel passionate about and simply go wherever the inspiration takes you. If that happens to align with what others want to watch then great, but if it dosn't, who cares. It's only Youtube, no one really cares anyway which is harsh but true. If you want to make a living out of it - maybe thats a different story and you should care more what others think, otherwise just do whatever feels good.


    My negative comment definitely wasn't about guys like you who are simply sharing their love of the hobby and are genuine, regardless of whether you have super in-depth knowledge or not. Even if your intention is to grow your channel and gain a following and you came to rF2 only somewhat recently, I see nothing wrong with that.

    There is just something about these bigger channels that rubs me the wrong way, like the wider they try to cast their net to appeal to a larger audience, the more superficial their content becomes. And then because they gain a somewhat decent following, they think they are suddenly authorities on simulation even though they really don't have much in depth knowledge on the subject. I am not saying that I do have such deep knowledge... my criticisms of simulation have become less as I realise that I don't have the amount of technical knowledge needed to make concrete definitive statements about hardcore physics questions, let alone how to simulate such physics.

    Funilly enough, a similar thing happened with Mythbusters (a kind of "selling-out). Where I saw that it was becoming more about the explosions and the spectacle, rather than staying true to the base concept. I noticed that some of there testing methods (though they were never really proper science) really took a real downturn with blatantly poor methods for testing something. It's like they no longer cared about the rigour of their testing, because it was more about pure entertainment. No doubt, it was all about entertainment to begin with obviously, but the passion of the presenters at least in the beginning was real.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2022
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  10. hitm4k3r

    hitm4k3r Registered

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    I don't think that your comment is actually that offtopic. A big part of the drama surrounding MSG is only that big because one YTer started to create videos about the topic and now the other guys come out of their ant piles and repeat the same stuff to be on the band wagon. And that's the reason why I stop watching YTers at one point or another when their channels become too big. Jimmy Broadbent (even when he is still a good guy) is a perfect example of how you sell out a sim racing channel. Yes, he is still making sim racing videos but the content is all over the place with zero focus and it's pretty obvious that YTers race the most recent racing games like GT7, F1 games and what not to boost their clicks. Ofcourse they are free to do with their channels how they please, but it's usualy the point when I stop watching. That said, there are few hidden gems like GPLaps. I really enjoy the style of his videos and focus of his channel.
     
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  11. green serpent

    green serpent Registered

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    Yeah GPLaps is great. Last time I randomly tuned into Jimmy I'm quite sure he was drunk... he used to do quite a bit of rF2 stuff but those days are long gone in favour of what the kids want to watch. It's all young people driving these clicks imo.

    The thing that is annoying about this pile-on that these creators are doing, is that they are dragging rF2 through the mud also, when really S397 has nothing to do with the alleged dodgy stuff.

    I mean Ermin practically worshipped rF2, and Marcel even dropped into one of Austin's live streams at one point just to see what was up and Austin was pretty wrapped. Yet both of them fail to mention to their viewers "don't hate on the guys at S397" or some such comment (maybe they did and I just fail to remember).
     
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  12. Love Guitars n Cars

    Love Guitars n Cars Registered

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  13. Travis

    Travis Registered

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    "Q1 2022 net loss was $16.0 million, as compared to Q1 2021 net loss of $14.1 million" and "Q1 2022 Adjusted EBITDA loss was $5.6 million, as compared to Q1 2021 Adjusted EBITDA loss of $2.8 million".

    One can only hope S397 and rF2 continue to remain unaffected.
     
  14. hitm4k3r

    hitm4k3r Registered

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    This means no more free coffee in the MSG canteen. :p
     
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  15. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Or a cheaper type :D
     
  16. F1Aussie

    F1Aussie Registered

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    Yet they did well enough for the ceo to have a 600% pay rise. o_O
     
  17. Simulation_Player

    Simulation_Player Registered

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    lol, 600% that sounds ridiculous and somehow funny. I wish that all the coorporate world didn't operate like that....lower level employee deserves little bit higher quality of life too. so that they don't have to save money, starve themselves of delicious foods just to get that new xbox/playstation.
    but then again this is why i will never be a CEO of anything because i can't possibly see myself giving me a 600% raise.......especially when you are operating a niche market as sim, here everyone is working hard to satisfy 0.1 % population of planet.
     
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  18. Martin Vindis

    Martin Vindis Registered

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    8000000 simracers around the world? I wish
     
  19. David O'Reilly

    David O'Reilly Registered

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    Or coin operated?
     
  20. David O'Reilly

    David O'Reilly Registered

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    Yes CEOS like to benchmark their pay with highest international standards but benchmark employee pay with the lowest international standards.
    That's how we get CEOs paying themselves the equivalent of 500 of their own staff.
    There needs to be a new ranking of average employee pay.
     
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