Another "hopefully one day our sims will sound like this" thread :)

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Spinelli, Sep 16, 2014.

  1. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    AMAZING!

    You don't even need to raise the volume of your speakers in order to sense the sheer volume and power that the sound of these cars emit (but crank your speakers anyways :) ). You can just tell from the way the camera picks up the sound, regardless of how low or high you set your actual speaker volume.




    (Ignore the jittery video)




    - 2:10 onwards HOLY CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!



    Even the V8s sound INSANE! Let alone the V10s, let alone the V12s, let alone the Ferrari V12s :)
     
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  2. Golanv

    Golanv Registered

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    *Cold Chills*
     
  3. Minibull

    Minibull Member

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    Another good recent one by 19Bozzy92. Nice and clear sounds from some Ferrari V10's

     
  4. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    Great vid Minibull...

    I don't know what it is about the new cameras though...Yes the audio is technically more clear and distorts much less, but the audio just sounds much, much "thinner". Also, the sound drops off much too quickly as the cars go off in the distance. In the old videos (like in the OP) you can just tell how powerful, full and loud the sounds are even when the cars are off in the distance (whether coming towards you or heading away from you), and even when you don't blast the volume of your speakers - while in the new videos you really have to blast your speaker volume to get a similar effect. Unless you completely blast your speakers, the old videos (like in the OP) are a much better representation of the sheer power and volume of the sound (I went to a race in 2005).
     
  5. Nazirull Safry Paijo

    Nazirull Safry Paijo Registered

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    Ive been talking abt sound for yeaarsss.
    But ppl are too bz generating screenshots

    When u look at replays,realistic graphics with poor sound makes it all feels like a bad badd cartoon.
     
  6. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    Exactly!!!

    Hopefully ISI ditches the Miles sound engine as it hardly seems to be progressing, and things tend to sound very digitized, not to mention AC announced that they are moving to the FMod sound engine, also PCars went through a heavy phase of audio improvements as well (I think it went beyond just better samples, but the core sound engine itself). I'm not trying to start a war between other games, I'm just mentioning the fact that other developers are FINALLY starting to put some focus into the sound engines. When compared to graphics, we are still in the 90s when it comes to sound engines in games, literally the 90s.

    Too bad most people just complain about stupid shaders, shadows, reflections, etc.


    P.S. Also, even in terms of graphics themselves, everyone is concerned with "taking a screenshot" graphics, rather than "how things move and interact with each other" graphics, like physics graphics, animations, etc. It's why Richard Burns Rally and Live For Speed still look so good to watch, even to this day, even though they look "bad" in terms of a frozen screenshot. It's so sad that 90% of people are 100x more concerned with "screenshot" GFX rather than movement/physics/interaction/animation graphics.
     
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  7. Nazirull Safry Paijo

    Nazirull Safry Paijo Registered

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    Sound is not mentioned in the interview so im not expecting much.
     
  8. Minibull

    Minibull Member

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    Just because something wasn't mentioned, does that mean it will never be looked at by the dev team? Shadow simuoation wasn't mentioned by the devs...neither was electric motors and batteries...

    Wait for the next interview or updates then, stay positive :)
    We have many years of continuing development with this product (and hopefully with all the current sims), I'm sure they will see to it at some point. That's why I like this style of development. Course, it relies on a bit of trust from the user to stick with it, but these guys are pushing the tech with simulating racing. Why wouldn't they rework the weather and look at sounds? For me anyhow, race rules, realroad and tyre modelling is more important that sounds for the meantime.



    I dunno Spinelli, I had the pleasure of watching a 1994 Ferrari 412 back in February, by itself at the Ruapuna track over the lunchbreak at the Skope Classic event. First day I took vids and watched it, second day I just watched it. What came out on the vids was basically what I was hearing, just not at the same levels of face vibrating noise and clarity. You can hear it is "loud" in the distance coming towards you, and it builds and builds till it's nearing passing you and you get that full blast of noise from it, which tails off with that slow distant muffling effect.
    I feel the other way to the first vid you posted, where some of the sound levels seem flat. When the car is in the distant coming towards with the exhaust pointing away sounds almost the same intensity as when the car is passing close by, just with a bit of added distortion. Kinda reminds me of auto leveling mics in some recordings I've heard.

    To me, that range is what makes it sound life like, you need to crank the speakers to get that level of noise from the recording being created.


    One thing I was thinking about is sort of a simulation of the "ears" ingame. We have the eye adaption thing for the view we are coming in and out of darkness. I wondered about having some kind of live ear that would dynamically distort sounds if it "felt" the sound was reaching the limits of it's hearing. Like if you have "levels" of noise that are know for each car, then depending on where the car is, how close, and where it is facing, it would affect this ear. So when we have the F1 cars go past in the replays, right when it is passing would sound different to if we had a stock MX-5 going past. One is going to be crazy loud and slightly distorted, the other is going to be pretty mild and clear.
    I dunno, this is my rambling thoughts haha. I have no idea what it would take to properly simulate sound and the effects. Probably a whole CPU or something XD.





    Just cause this is sounds. And car sounds. And all that jazz. This oldie but a goodie vid. Cheers Nick Mason, sad you've sold it.

    Please Tim...how awesome this thing would be, with all it's misfires XD






    EDIT: Awesome, Goodwood vid from 2 days ago. Hardly revving it but still :D

     
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  9. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    Put your speaker volume low, then listen to the second video I posted as of 2:20 onwards, then listen to the Ferrari F1 video you posted (make sure to have the volume levels as similar as possible, and overall relatively low). It's night and day difference in terms of ferocity. It's kind of irrelevant and just a camera/mic thing, and has nothing to do with rF2 or general gaming sound, so I'm kind of just rambling and arguing for nothing, lol, I just think sometimes the newer videos don't give the sense of sheer volume and power that the older, lower quality recorders do. When I went to an F1 race in 2005, it sounded much, much closer to the second video I posted, but just with 2005 engines, rather than the video you posted which makes them sound kind of tame, well unless I blast my speakers, then that's a different story, but then again anything will sound "crazy" if I blast my speakers.

    I completely agree with you with what you said about the distortion thing in games. It could kind of be like HDR, but for audio instead of visual. Audio modelling is so primitive in video-games compared to graphics :( . Most people just don't care about audio like they do with graphics, same with movies. Man, I practically play Battlefield over all other first person shooters JUST because of the audio, I wait for the house to be empty so that I can crank the hell out of movies just for the audio. I purchase Blu-rays mostly for the audio.
     
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  10. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    Most people just don't notice audio. Even in movies eg. the Transformers movies have the crappiest audio. People don't even notice or understand when I tell them. Then if it's on I start pointing all sorts of things out that could/should have sounded so good, so crazy, so intense, and they only then finally realize what I mean. Man, I could have made all those different lasers, pulse cannons, lol whatever, have SO much more sound to them. The highs, the mids, the lows, the overall detail and complexity of the sounds, the variation of the sounds, everything, they just completely suck in that move and in so many.

    Even in Rush. Most people thought it sounded great, which is hilarious because if you actually listen to the movie you can tell that when the cars pass by (external) they are almost always on part-throttle, not full throttle, and on top of that they are almost always revved not even close to their max RPM. Low to mid RPM combined with part-throttle, that's sad. Then during the onboard shots they just don't have the depth, "thickness" and complexity/layers to the sound like they should, they sound too thin, almost like when you watch an onboard on television rather than what it's like to really be in the car, which is what they should have done for the movie.

    What's a more visceral experience, turning off your monitor but cranking the hell out of the audio, shaking the house, feeling the rush through your body, the tingles, the vibrations, the drama, OR muting the speakers completely but just watching a pretty car made up of 2D pixels move around on your screen/monitor, LOL, I just don't get it, there should be soooooooooooooooo much more emphasis and focus on audio.

    Hell the main reason why most non-racing fans enjoy watching a live race, other than for crashes (sadly), is.....you guessed it, the sound. Everyone, absolutely everyone, says the sound is the most amazing part about going to the races. It's what raises their heartbeat, it's what makes them jump up and down laughing like they were 12 years old again, it's what makes their hairs stand up. The sound is what makes the cars seem scary and appear to be ALIVE, BREATHING MONSTERS instead of just really fast cars with lots of technology packed into them (current F1, Formula E, etc.). The sound is why my friend refers to the 3.5 L Ferrari F1s (89-94) as a DRAGON - not because of the speed or the looks or the technology, but because of the SOUND.

    Sound = passion and soul :)
     
  11. Minibull

    Minibull Member

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    It's the first thing that stunned me years ago with GTL. I had raced from Grand Prix 2 and indycar racing 2 through many console racing games then to RBR and GPL. Then I got GT Legends and that was the first thing that floored me about it. The sounds compared to anything I had done before was just stunning. The sound of that Cobra and Capri, loved it.
     
  12. FatCity

    FatCity Registered

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    That 94 Imola vid, when there is no car in picture at Aqua Minerale ( I think that's the corner ) and you can hear one coming, the sound is enough to make you crap yourself, its terrifying in an unbelievable way, just fantastic.
     
  13. speed1

    speed1 Banned

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  14. Guimengo

    Guimengo Guest


    These are delightful but actually it's not clear at all. These are super sharp and "whole" live, the microphone there just couldn't cope with the noise. Better than the average Youtube F1 video sound but in absolute terms, nah ahn. I was wondering which games have the audio where you can properly hear the cars from far away? I've seen some RaceRoom videos that seem to capture it but it seems like it go amiss in most places. I remember in Spa, still a fair way away (couple of km) from the track the engines could be heard - even GP2.
     
  15. Marc Collins

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    The F1ASR 1992 mod (soon to be something other than "F1") captures the sounds of these engines better than any mod or sim to date. Spine tingling. Of course they could get even better in the future, but for now anyone who appreciates the power of audio as an essential element of sim racing immersion needs to try those cars.
     
  16. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    F1 ASR is pretty good, but there is only so much that can be done by the modder, just like a physics engine.

    On a side note, the Lambo in F1 ASR 92 sounds like it is being very under revved even though you bring it to redline, and it doesn't have enough change when going from lower revs to max revs. This isn't an issue with the sound engine but I thought I'd mention it since F1 92 ASR was brought up.
     
  17. Nazirull Safry Paijo

    Nazirull Safry Paijo Registered

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    simple example


    the building up of sound.
    from far away, u can hear the low frequency ones, coz it travels further. Not the absence of sound at all.
    And also reverbs.
    (Sound bouncing off the walls in rf2 is a nice start :)
     
  18. Marc Collins

    Marc Collins Registered

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    Which car is the "Lambo?"
     
  19. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    I'm pretty sure the colourful, mostly yellow and blue, car uses a Lambo V12. One of it's drivers might be Eric Comas.
     
  20. Saabjock

    Saabjock Registered

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    I always figured the lack of sound samples in racing sims was a limitation of hardware and software... but then the DRM mod with (specifically the Zakspeed Capri) was released and that shot the whole thing to hell.
    That car had unstable combustion pops, misfires, transmission take-up...all the things to make you believe you're driving a real car.
    It left me wanting more and got to a point I was running that mod 90% of the time.
     

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