What becomes of rFactor2?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Kickbox, Feb 14, 2014.

  1. DurgeDriven

    DurgeDriven Banned

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  2. GCCRacer

    GCCRacer Banned

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    Speaking of UI...

    I wonder how hard it would be to save the whole set of race parameters (including player selected car, opponent cars, number of cars, selected track...) and load it with a commandline option, i.e. "rfactor2launcher.exe -enduranceracersilverstone"

    For offline this would be very fast way to get racing without even seeing the UI.
     
  3. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    I love Reiza (well I do have some issues with Niels' general philosophy towards FFB and car behaviour & grip feel, but that is just a personal thing and thanks to ISI and their engine I can tune that myself, so it's not too much of an issue). Just had some online fun in a random pickup Formula Truck race the other night with a few guys. Great racing, guys were fast but fair, consistent, clean, etc. Great fun. However, I agree with the quoted post above 100%.

    Are you serious? How sure are you of this? The potential in the RFactor 2 engine is enormous. Even if RFactor 2 keept everything unchanged from RFaftor 1 except for the physics the potential would still be enormous.

    If this is true I hope it has nothing to do with Niels and his seemingly unwillingness to learn RFactor 2's tyre model which is a billion times better than RFactor 1. I know he was stating he had some quick looks at the RF2 tyre model a while back and it was too complex/non-user friendly, not to mention he seems to constantly defend the RFactor 1 tyre model as if it's just as good as anything else and doesn't have issues as long as you work it properly and plug in the correct numbers, which is not even close to true as I can see/experience the same physics issues/weirdness in any Game Stock Car or Formula Truck car as I can in any other pre-RFactor 2 ISI engine based car/mod, no matter how good or bad the car/mod is.

    You tell em! :)

    That's because ISI / RFactor and IRacing (regardless of how much you may like or dislike their physics) are "hardcore" simulations. Sadly, other "sims" seem to be deviating from this and on towards a "just another video-game" type of mentality/approach, all in the pursuit of more sales, and therefore money. It's too bad, really too bad.

    RFactor 2, RFactor 1and IRacing are the only racing sims where I feel like I am driving an "at home, industial style, racing simulation training tool". Everything else out there, regardless of how good or bad they might be, just makes me feel like I am playing a video-game on a 23 inch monitor in my bedroom.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 28, 2014
  4. peterchen

    peterchen Registered

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    Sorry to say, but in my opinion Niels is much overrated.
    My knowledge of the physics engine is not as complete as Niels´
    but I was already able to make more believable tyres after
    two years than he do now.
    As strange is that he finds AC good, the only other sim he put his hands on.
    I can only say: If the street-corvette would behave in real life as Niels´Corvette,
    it would not be allowed to sell to public.

    Greets
    Pete
     
  5. Jamie Shorting

    Jamie Shorting Registered

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    Niels has said in his talk and drive videos he likes the old school simplified tire model and he doesn't want to learn anything else. That explains why he likes other titles. ;)
     
  6. peterchen

    peterchen Registered

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  7. hexagramme

    hexagramme Registered

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    The UI is just fine. Christ the fuss some people make over it is beyond me!
    This is a simulator. The driving matters. Nothing else.

    Do you think the guys working the pro simulators in F1 teams fuss over the look of the interface?
    They probably just have some sort of command console, write some lines of text maybe to start it up and get on with it. :)
     
  8. Adrianstealth

    Adrianstealth Registered

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    Hiya,

    I've mentioned the Rf2 UI a few times, it really dosn't bother me personally at all -I don't like them but I flick through them very quickly,
    however we must consider the bigger picture

    The latest / current sims have very very good UI's - iracing & AC
    (I'm not a big fan of AC as a "sim" but that's another matter), the UI gives a first impression of any piece of software,
    in a time that the competition seem to be raising the bar rf2's UI it really doesn't give a 1st good impression to a potential purchaser ( who may take a look at rf2 on a friends PC, or even give the free demo a try)

    A friend of mine whilst looking at rf2 at my place (few builds ago) said "I feel like I'm back in the 90's) whilst I was selecting car & track in the UI before even getting into the sim/car/track, the present UI gives a dated & un-designed image.

    Maybe because I run a marketing business and I quickly notice these type of things and put importance on presentation & first impressions.

    Rf2's UI is about on par with that of Rfactor 1's UI -but at it's time of release in 2005 it was fine,
    We are now nearly a decade on.

    The overall look of rf2's UI is very poor by today's standards & it's not even officially released yet

    P.s I may not be correct in the release comment as I'm a tad confused as to is it still in alpha / beta or what?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 28, 2014
  9. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    I can't stand the AC UI, it's a mix of text, pictures and icons and sometimes I go in circles when adjusting settings like car, track, session settings, etc. You can't just read and click like you can in RF2's UI, you are clicking different pictures, icons, things are sliding and moving, it's one large mess in my opinion.

    I didn't even realise the different versions/upgrades of each individual car until like a month after they came out because I think it's some tiny little icon thingy. It's trying way to hard to be modern, "cool", appeal to the masses, etc.

    RF2 on the other hand could look more fancy and modern, and maybe move things around so less clicks are required, but overall RF2's UI still feels more functional to me, and with less thinking involved on things like where in the UI you are, what you are clicking on, etc.

    Really though why do people care about UI so much? It's just screens to edit options, select your car/track, etc. It's not even really part of the game lol. I understand missing features that should be added to the Ui (things in the player.PLR and controller.INI files) but just things like the look of an options page and stuff like that, really?

    I love Niels' work, don't get me wrong, what he does for RF1 based stuff like Game Stock Car 2013 is amazing, however what I can't stand is how he defends the RFactor 1 tyre model and makes it seem like it's as good as anything out there as long as you plug in the correct numbers. I mean that is utter BS. There is a core physics/tyre engine that is running all the numbers and parameters plugged into it and that obviously cannot be modded (this falls for all aspect of the physics obviously, not just the tyre model).

    5 minutes after playing the RFactor 2 truck mod and it already blows away Reiza's Formula Truck. Maybe Niels has done a much better job technically with much more accurate/better values plugged into the tyre model due to maybe having more resources, budget, etc. Than the guy who created/converted the RF2 truck mod, but the sheer prowess of the RF2 tyre model (and physics engine in general) makes the RFactor 2 truck mod destroy Reiza's Formula Truck.
     
  10. DurgeDriven

    DurgeDriven Banned

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    Yeah but Formula Truck feels better then any rF truck mod hey :)

    rF2 Formula Truck ? :eek:

    Not good to use a rip to diss clients of the same developer. hehehehe ;)
     
  11. marvelharvey

    marvelharvey Registered

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    Indeed, I find the UI does it's job and gets me into races. However, as you mentioned, when trying to sell rF2 to friends, the UI gives a very poor first impression, one even asking 'What year was this made?'. Whilst it's fine for the majority of us on these forums, the interface is something I see regularly critised elsewhere on the internet and I wonder how it may have affected sales.
     
  12. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    I'm not dissing. I'm saying that due to the underlying tyre model and overall physics model underneath an RF2 truck mod, that it behaves (and feels) way better than an RF1 game/mod (Reiza's Formula Truck) that has most likely had much, much more resources, official data, physics expertise, etc. poured into it, again, due to the superiority of the base/core RF2 tyre model and overall physics engine.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 1, 2014
  13. R1CHO

    R1CHO Registered

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    everythings a rip to durge lol
     
  14. osella

    osella Registered

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    You're literally the first person with that view I came across, you have right to that opinion ofc.

    When you're moving between garage settings like from aero to gears there are slowly moving arrows on upper part of screen BUT the actual selection from aero to gears settings is immediate. At first I was also scared that AC UI "looked too good and consoleish" but after actually spending 5minutes with it I fell in love. It doesn't just LOOK good - that shouldn't be a priority in racing sim after all - but it WORKS perfectly as well. While chaning setup you're still sat in your car and not just view numbers like it's in every other sim ever released. Change ride height and your view actually moves up/down. It's an unnecessary detail but it's so nice to have. Not even talking about seat position apps, gmeter apps and others, those are all things I always wished for in rf1 for years. Nobody forces them to use them, you can have plain view all the time.

    Sorry I can't get rid of feeling that you are HUGELY pro-RF2 biased and you don't want to accept at slightest that anything other than RF2 could be better in any area so you'd defend RF2 even it was clearly worse for everybody else.

    I think that how important UI is for people depends on how long races they do and how often they change anything. Those who do 2+ hours races all the time and not touch graphic settings etc. find UI unimportant part. But I think most of us usually do 15-40min races and change cars/tracks/settings often so for us UI is truly not negligible part of the sim.
     
  15. samuelw

    samuelw Registered

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  16. peterchen

    peterchen Registered

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    My opinion:
    When you know the rF1 UI than you get used to the rF2 UI pretty quick.
    Could be more intuitive though...
    I only wonder about one thing:
    When the UI is so bad, why the hack is there no alternative around that someone have modded???

    Greets
    Pete
     
  17. DurgeDriven

    DurgeDriven Banned

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    I did not think so, but the OP never made it clear
    that is why I asked, thanks.

    After having a drive I do not agree with early comment
    though.

    I don't think rF2 " blows away " GSC either, or new gen sims, never have and I do not use terms like " blows away " :rolleyes:

    However through misinterpretation I get accused of being a troll. ?

    If DD said "rF2 blows away pCARS" .......... I would be labelled a troll. ? lol


    Try to compare one track , PCARS , rF2 and ( the new GPL "Historically correct" Belgium hehehe ) you are a troll or bringing up pointless comparisons. lol :rolleyes: ....hehehe



    Nice video bit of a shame they never made CCM "fly by wire" ( written script ) for smooth camera movement and added some of Trakers effects.

    edit: You know watching the Ferrari lap I feel rF2 F1 are just too feral.
    Look at the gentle throttle control through Eau Rouge needed ..........this is how it was. :)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 1, 2014
  18. hexagramme

    hexagramme Registered

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    I find AC's UI quite unattractive as well. Going around in circles tends to get boring after a while. Counter intuitive and confusing. Yuk, I say.

    Imho there's no risk of rF2 "losing out" to AC any time soon. Wow that sim is a downright mess right now.

    Every other Friday I try to download the new AC update, hoping that it has taken a turn for the better.

    Last night I really had enough. It's just such a mess. I actually got a bit excited about the Lotus single seater and Nürburgring GP, but to no avail.

    The FFB under braking makes my G27 shake so violently that it woke up the entire house. Same deal as with the Formula Abarth.
    "Oh right I forgot" I thought to myself; "Kunos says that's just the way it supposed to be in single seaters if I can't drive with a proper wheel".
    I tried very hard to solve this problem a couple of months back, on the official forums, but the devs just labeled my thread "no issue".
    Only "solution" is to dial the ffb way down until there are practically no forces at all.

    Okay then... No single seaters for me then. On to the GT cars. Maybe that's fun.
    Well... Yeah. For hotlapping. Not racing against AI. Never ever race the AI in this sim. Ever.
    It's beyond me how Kunos thinks it's a good idea to release the AI so early, because it's basically useless.
    The AI in GRID or Gran Turismo have more talent than this worthless bunch.

    10 lap race. 7 times I was rammed off the track. 9 times I was crashed into because the AI swerves in the braking zones.

    To finish off my little rant, I'll repeat what I said earlier about the AC tracks. Though laser scanned, everything just looks so drab and uninspired. Nothing feels living or exciting. Just drab.
    ISI still has the lead in my world. Way off into the distance.
     
  19. MarcG

    MarcG Registered

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    He made it clear in the very first post of his Truck thread, your continuous accusations of ripped content are becoming extremely tiresome, if you feel something is ripped gain proof and e-mail ISI, if you cant then shut the hell up.
     
  20. hexagramme

    hexagramme Registered

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    +1000

    C:\Terminate_broken_record_mode>
     

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