For some reason my ttool stucks at test 13 and keeps running between 4% and 0.73% completed, I let it run for more than 12 hours and it just kept running between that back and forth. I tried then bit differently and chose only to perform one iteration, it worked, then I did set 5 into iterations per frame, just to test quickly what happens, but it gets stuck to that too, loops forever between percentages. Most likely fault is in my tires, it is just interesting how it manages to end up into loop where program can't find escape unless I stop calculation. It might be that there are some reason for this or that there are anything possible why this happens, but if some certain reason causes such, that might be nice to figure out as it could be helpful in future, maybe some day I know that too, but at the moment I start just to poke it randomly by changing my tire without much of clue which part needs changing
No, but I did try 0.99 and that seemed not to have much of effect. I did change now Nylon ply that is close to thread (so placed bottom at each node) to be 40 degrees instead of 0 degrees, which I assumed it to be, and I got to test 21, but again it has been there long time, there seem to be progress in graphics however, but percentage down seem to be getting lower if anything. Somehow I think there is great error in my thinking of how to lay up those different layers and perhaps construction then is impossible. Here is sample from sidewall, close to shoulder area: [Node] // 6 Geometry=(0.104,-0.304,0.005) BulkMaterial=(273.15,925,16000000,0.47,-1,1250,3.7) BulkMaterial=(373.15,903,12000000,0.47,-1,1290,3.52) AnisoCarcassConductivityMult=(1.5,1,1.1) TreadDepth=0.0075 TreadMaterial=(273.15,925,9500000,0.47,-1,2000,0.172) TreadMaterial=(373.15,903,7300000,0.47,-1,2200,0.165) RingAndRim=(1,0) //polyester PlyParams=(90,0.0004,3) PlyMaterial=(273.15,1415,3000000,0.37,-1,1000,0.24) PlyMaterial=(373.15,1385,2500000,0.37,-1,1050,0.23) This is thread area: [Node] // 13 Geometry=(0.028,-0.337,0.0063) BulkMaterial=(273.15,925,26500000,0.46,-1,1250,4.6) BulkMaterial=(373.15,903,20500000,0.46,-1,1290,4.4) AnisoCarcassConductivityMult=(1.2,1,2) TreadDepth=0.0095 TreadMaterial=(273.15,925,9500000,0.47,-1,2000,0.172) TreadMaterial=(373.15,903,7300000,0.47,-1,2200,0.165) RingAndRim=(1,0) //polyester PlyParams=(90,0.0004,3) PlyMaterial=(273.15,1415,3000000,0.37,-1,1000,0.24) PlyMaterial=(373.15,1385,2500000,0.37,-1,1050,0.23) //steel PlyParams=(0,0.0009,3) PlyMaterial=(273.15,7907,201500000000,0.3,-1,450,52) PlyMaterial=(373.15,7879,195500000000,0.3,-1,485,50) //steel PlyParams=(0,0.0009,3) PlyMaterial=(273.15,7907,201500000000,0.3,-1,450,52) PlyMaterial=(373.15,7879,195500000000,0.3,-1,485,50) //polyamid nylon 6-6(PA) PlyParams=(40,0.0004,3) PlyMaterial=(273.15,1305,2100000000,0.3,-1,1695,0.25) PlyMaterial=(373.15,1285,1700000000,0.3,-1,1715,0.24) It is experiment, not based completely on any real world version, except layers are from tire that I did cut, well, more or less, exact parameters might be different. Another thing I have changed is gauge pressure to be 200kpa for optimal and of course shape/size of tire, but I suspect that maybe belts are need to adjusted, maybe that polyamid layer needs to be 90 degrees, but I thought it would be 0 degrees, no real knowing about it, at least now with 40 degrees it has gone to stage where empty tire is spinning fast and is of course flat because it is empty, everything looks to be how I except it to be, but it has been 3 hours in test 21 now, my earlier attempts where I managed to do the tire did progress differently for sure. It might be that sidewall is not enough strong as it is, but there really is just one layer of polyester in reality and sidewall is not very strong. Maybe DT multiplier set to lot lower (to 0.9 for example) will help, might try that next, however I have not seen things that tutorial mentions, but maybe better test that than turn belts around
Street tire has very flexible sidewall, because street tire must to be comfortably in some way. When you will put normal street tire to GT3 car it will be ripped off in 5 minutes... If racing tires would be constructed like street tires, F1 car will damage the tire after 2 corners. Everything is alright with one polyester ply.
Change number of belts/plies/how do you call them? Anyway, I have this at sidewall, this is just one node, you must of course make changes to all nodes that are at sidewalls: //polyester PlyParams=(90,0.0004,3) PlyMaterial=(273.15,1415,3000000,0.37,-1,1000,0.24) PlyMaterial=(373.15,1385,2500000,0.37,-1,1050,0.23) That is one of those belt/ply things, so to make two of them, from my understanding you just need to copy it, so that it is like: //polyester PlyParams=(90,0.0004,3) PlyMaterial=(273.15,1415,3000000,0.37,-1,1000,0.24) PlyMaterial=(373.15,1385,2500000,0.37,-1,1050,0.23) //polyester PlyParams=(90,0.0004,3) PlyMaterial=(273.15,1415,3000000,0.37,-1,1000,0.24) PlyMaterial=(373.15,1385,2500000,0.37,-1,1050,0.23) Now it is twice as strong, rTrainer has two, my street tyre has one and among steet tires those mine were rather weak from sidewall, lot of flex and more modern tire is more flexible at sidewall, older radials were stronger, much better feel at corners, but modern stuff is not very precise so to say, too much of flex for my liking, but I guess they try to be comfy. You can of course change material settings of sidewalls, maybe make thicker layer of material, also I think that having angle other than 90 degrees might also effect stiffness, but I'm not sure to which way, it would require bit more studying to understand that for me, currently I try to learn just basic tire creating, then I start learning what effects different angles etc. will have, but not too much at once. One thing I have found out is that when I gather more information, look pics of how tires are constructed, then I read ISI's tire tutorial again, I find lot of new things from tutorial, things that I understand better, but it is taking some time to get it all into my thick skull.
As you can see here: BF R1(street homologated racing slick) has at sidewall 2 nylon plies, very stiff, very different to normal radial street tire So yes, in rF2 sidewall and overall tire stiffness is affected by number of plies what is on the sidewall nodes and materials of this plies(and of course tread and bulk material). Angle around 90 degrees should be softer than for example 45 degrees, but two plies 20 and 160 deegres will be stiffer than two plies 45 deegres. 0 deegre = piles is || 90 = plies is _|_ etc. Hope this will help how to think about ply angle.
I put this here, so I can next time perhaps remember and look names of parts from pics, much easier to discuss when names are known http://www.tiresfirst.com/page-tire-construction_65.php http://www.discountpartcenter.com/tiresafety/YokohamaTireConstruction.gif
Here is easy to understand explanation what makes radial tire radial and so on: http://www.motorera.com/dictionary/bi.htm So if you put sidewall plies to angle you are not creating radial tire any longer, it would be bias belted after that. Often I see that steel belts are some other angle than 0 degrees, but also I have seen them at 0 degrees. Also cap ply or ply that is between steel belts and thread if there is only single one, there seem not to be much of information about angle of that, often displayed even without angle, some times 0 degrees. Steel belts at angle are probably sporty tire feature and comfy tires are maybe such that steel belts are 0 degrees, what do you think, is it reasonable to make such conclusion?
Angles around 90 are allowed in radial tire like 92 and 88 for 2ply sidewall But other will do biasply tire or if you add tread plies it will be bias belted jtbo - no, dont do any conclusions or universal thinking about tire. If you want to know angles you must get direct info about that tire model what you want to do.
This is going to be the hard part, finding enough real info on tyres. Especially older or OEM specific tyres :S
you're not going to find any real info on tires... this is racing tire 101... don't tell anyone how you made your tire. oh and don't feed the troll.
Also even if you would have real data, it does not necessarily result any more real result than estimate of how tire is built, surely it would be more solid foundation to build the tire, but it might not still be anything more than a base. With street tires at least some way it is possible to find out how it is made, if nothing else, then from junkyard get one that is too worn or broken to be used anything, might get such free and then start taking it apart. Of course it is rather messy and still will be mystery what kind of rubber is used, but it is step forward from nothing. Sadly race tires, especially at higher level are something one can't except to get hands on, finding data is also quite difficult if not impossible so only way is to estimate and for that general idea of what is done differently in such itre is of course something that might be better than nothing, even it would not result very accurate tire. Or then wait until ISI comes up with such tire when they add content and then trust that ISI has got the data. There are many hurdles to meet surely. Some will think that there is no point making any other tires that those where is concrete data, well what about if that would be 155/80/13 from Lada, would that opinion still hold? There are indeed many ways to see the issue, but my view is that what method will make possible relatively close to realworld performance and that is simple to implement with lack of data, that method should provide best results on average with limitations that we have.
Of course yes, but the best way of build the tire is to have the real tire or have data from someone But most of modder dont even want to spend time collecting real data about tire and then we have mods like F1 Liga 2012 or this BMW conversion. @jtbo - if you have real data you need to know how to read them, what some infos mean etc so yes, without knowledge real data is useless I agree. About F1 tires or LMP1 tire, yes, we cant get them, this tires always will be probably "fantasy" tires, but againg, with knowledge about tires, racing tires from smaller series we can build some tire what probably will be good enough to put them in LMP1, with F1 car this is way more difficult sadly.
Every time I try to start the tool it crashes immediately I also tried to run as administrator, didn't help.. Does anyone have an idea? edit: Ok, now every 10 times it goes well and the tire tool loads. But when I start entering "Iterations per frame" values it crases immediately.
