Targa Florio WIP

Discussion in 'Locations' started by 6e66o, Oct 1, 2012.

  1. datasting

    datasting Registered

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    Thanks for you Hard work. Your Upgrade from v 0.13 to v 1.08 its mindblowing even without rain!!
     
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  2. svictor

    svictor Registered

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    Thanks!
    PS: I still have plan to update IOM wet effect, once I have finished with next dundrod update, though probably will take a long while.
     
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  3. Mitch9

    Mitch9 Registered

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    I should probably post an update. It is true that working with this track takes longer just because of how big it is, add to this some experimentation, mishaps and computer related issues and suddenly an entire year goes by :D

    There´s been some progress though so here´s the state of things:

    First the maiin road, I´ve tried to smooth out its originall flatness; this was mostly present on longer straights so the efffect should be subtle, but there are some shorter sections in which the change might be more noticable.
    t3.PNG
    t4.PNG
    (the crown that svictor added is also conserved but the noise on the track will get a different treatment).


    I´ve got some new materials ready to test for the road. Originally there were more than 100 road materials; I´m hoping the count will decrease to 12 or 15 at most, but if need be I think it could be as low as 8 materials or so.
    @svictor mentioned some instability when trying to apply the realroad effects, hopefully reducing the material count will solve this issue.
    Not sure if this will reduce overall vram load as the pbr shaders require a number of texture maps per material to work, but I´m still hoping the overall count will decrease substantially.


    Another big issue are the barriers; they dont have dedicated collision objects and you can get stuck in some of then (the 2d armcos, for example) so that needs to be sorted as well.
    There were gaps in the terrain where the barriers originally seat - all those are closed now so that´s a big chunk of work done.
    The next time sink is making curves on the locations of all the original barriers (400+) so that the new models can be arrayed easily.
    tbarr.PNG


    Finally, I´ve been wasting too much time toying with the idea of adding a 3D background to the scene; it would look really cool and all but it´s also a bit of a challenge. Should probably focus on finishing the previous stuff so that I can actually release something this year.:D
    tbk.PNG
     
  4. davehenrie

    davehenrie Registered

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    Images like these blow my mind, locating the scenery, placing the bones of the track in the correct orientation etc is just... Cool!
     
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  5. pilAUTO

    pilAUTO Registered

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    Thank you very much guys for all this work.

    This track, because of these specificities, is absolutely incredible.

    I would like to find a "Sebring" aspect in the physics of the track, I'm thinking of the bumps...

    Courage in any case.
     
  6. svictor

    svictor Registered

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    Due to steam region block, I could not post any replies on workshop.

    I'll reply here for user marv , who messaged about a track issue on workshop page:
    --------------------------
    Thanks for your comments and feedback.

    The problem (floating trees) you have encountered is not a track issue, but an issue with some vehicle mods. The vehicle (Atom V8) you were driving is using a none-default camera LOD-multiplier value of 2.0 (any value greater than 1.0 is none-default for cockpit view), which this value gets multiplied with each objects' LOD (level of detail) distance value, and resulted in wrong rendering range (revealing more distanced objects than they should).

    Try a 397's official vehicle with cockpit and this issue should no longer be seen.

    This problem can only be fixed from vehicle Mod side, as camera LOD-multiplier value bypasses track's LOD value. You may want to contact the author of the specific vehicle mod for a fix to cockpit camera LOD-multiplier.

    For reference: default cockpit LOD-multiplier value is 1.0, while swingman view has 2.0 value, which means swingman view will always see further away, as how the game is designed for. You can also find more detailed description about this issue in Isle of Man forum thread as well.
    --------------------------
     
  7. gianluca

    gianluca Registered

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    Marv is me in Steam. Thanks for the info, was the first time that I tried the Atom in Targa.
    I'll point the problem to the author of the mod.

    Please, get rid of the flowers, all of them. They look like those used in the funeral arrangements. :D
    Outside the villages there can be some trees or bushes with flowers on them, but it's a seasonal thing. In game you can do wihout them and make all green, or with some white, light yellow and light pink flowers over some bushes.
    Also, when we spawn in the box area, the 2D mechanics are really bad looking. Don't we have some S397 3D marshalls and mechanics to kidnap from another track and use for the job? ;)
    Again, like I've said in my Steam comment, I know this kind of stuff take lot of time to be polished, so mine is just a wishlist. :)
    It's great to have this track and the Isle of Man in game.

    By the way, I'm subscribed also to Anglesey, that if I'm correct is the circuit where Chris Harris drifted the F40 and the F50. Great job on that too. I love the grass field with the daisies: so nice looking.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2022
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  8. svictor

    svictor Registered

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    Hi, thanks again for feedback.

    The generic flowers near road side were already greatly reduced in the last two updates, those little flowers are really sparse now. I could remove all of them, but some players may prefer to keep those flowers, it will be a difficult decision.

    Alternatively, I could make two layouts, one with generic flowers, one without, though I need to test and see if it is achievable without having to make a whole copy of entire 3D grass model(about 397mb file size total).

    There are also a few special flower fields, which mainly are those red flowers, they were originally 2D ground flower textures that original Targa authors has created, which I translated them into 3D. Those flowers will be kept as they are, because one of the most important aspect is to faithfully preserve all those things the original GPL Targa authors had created. This includes the 2D crowds and pit staff, they are part of the original "ART" of the GPL Targa Florio, and is like a historic thing from modding community as well. So from my point of view, I'd kept those things as how they were. (same applies to isle of man)

    I'll see what I can do with 3D grass, but no promise it will be made. As I have said earlier that I concluded all the work on Targa and moving on to other projects, and have no further intention to continue updating the track other than necessary fixes.

    And @Mitch9 is currently working very hard on a much much bigger update for this track, which is something to look after in the future.

    Thank you for understanding, and enjoy the ride.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2022
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  9. Woodee

    Woodee Registered

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    I can understand you wanting to keep the "GPL stuff", but it would be nice to drag this course into the 21st century like you have done with track surface. As a VR driver seeing a low res 2D marshall or tree can sometimes be very jarring. rF2 is generation above where GPL came from and should reflect it graphically. If all GPL converted tracks remained like their GPL counterpart we would have 256x256 16 bit diffuse textures and no dynamic lighting. :D

    I also understand we are pushing the limits of what gmotor can physically do with a track this big so "trade-offs" must be made.
     
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  10. gianluca

    gianluca Registered

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    I thought that the reason why these 2D and low res stuff was left in the conversion was because of the time and the effort it would take to upgrade them to modern standards. The idea of leaving them to keep somehow the original GPL vibe is a bit strange. I'd keep just the crowd and place the people closed together and in higher number in order to try to hide their 2D and old look.

    The original track was done that way, because they were limited by the software and the hardware of the time. With the RF2 engine, or the UE5, the GPL Targa would have had a different look. Few flowers here and there, probably weight less than the side of an hill full of bushes.
    Once the main road is nailed and you guys want to polish the sides and the pit area, you don't have any obligation to keep low res textures or 2D models where you don't like them. Assuming that you will want to keep working on this. If won't be the case, well nobody could really complain, because it's already a great conversion and a very long and time consuming modding adventure.
     
  11. svictor

    svictor Registered

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    Hi, as I said that keeping original GPL assets is only my point of view.

    It is good to wish for better graphics, but saying "256x256 16 bit diffuse" is a little over exaggerated, and this track does use all kinds of advanced RF2 shader from DX9 to DX11 era thanks to various modders who had worked on it (although they are not PBR).

    Not to mention that all the modders were working day & night for years with all the cares and efforts, whether small or big, low-res or high-res, to produce a legendary track that is ahead of any modern sim of its time and is free.

    And yes, GPL tracks are made with its own various limitations. Many of the real and lengthy technical difficulties were already mentioned & explained in many earlier pages. It will be difficult to list all of them, but anyone who has ever worked on those GPL tracks knows the limitations and difficulties behind scene.

    Just to say that no work is easy for modding, and especially for mod at this scope, which was one of the reason this track had been deserted for over 7 years without any update previously. And many "update to modern standards" attempts, are essentially the same as rebuilding them from scratch, which takes time and courage to try.

    Time for me to move on to other projects.

    Good luck to anyone who is working on this track or will be in the future.

    All the best.
     
  12. DJCruicky

    DJCruicky Registered

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    The magnitude of a task like that is huge. As a track modder myself, I know this is not easy.
    I'm already very thankful for everything SVictor has done on the track. I will say it one more time, "You have achieved the impossible SVictor thank you :).
     
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  13. Woodee

    Woodee Registered

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    I was referring to what GPL had.... 20 years ago.
     
  14. svictor

    svictor Registered

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    It's Summer Time
    20220902180002_1.jpg

    v1.09 update (2022-9-02)
    - Added a new full-length layout Targa Florio 1967 Summer, with all dry grass field as frequently requested. Over a hundred textures has been adjusted to fit the new summer theme.
    - No more generic flowers from summer layout.

    Happy driving

    20220902175831_1.jpg 20220902175753_1.jpg 20220902175434_1.jpg
     
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  15. Woodee

    Woodee Registered

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    I would like to commend your optimisation efforts because before I struggled to be alone on track. With 1.08 I was able to run with some AIs. The Caterham's would crash a lot... but I could run in VR with some AIs!
     
  16. svictor

    svictor Registered

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    Hi, no worries, thanks for your feedback.

    As for AI, original AI path is very rough and has a lot of issues (for example I have fixed many crazy zigzag paths on drag strip layout), but to fix everything is beyond my help. Those three months that I had spent on working with Isle of Man AIW path was one of the toughest & dragging task, which I was mentally exhausted afterwards.

    Also I don't have unlimited strength and time to do so many things, and there are still other projects I have to finish. Hoping one day someone might be interested in picking up and improving AIW for this track.
     
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  17. mantasisg

    mantasisg Registered

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    I swear there are two types of people in this world. Those that adore lush green healthy nature, and those who like when vegetation is struggling to survive :D
     
  18. DJCruicky

    DJCruicky Registered

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    Thank you again. Just when I thought you were finished with the track you make another nice update :). New layout looks very nice.

    Time for you to put your feet up, have a nice rest, and don't burn yourself out mate.
     
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  19. vava74

    vava74 Registered

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  20. DJCruicky

    DJCruicky Registered

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    Hey svictor,
    Would you like me to give the AI file some love?
    I've actually already made a start on it and making good progress.
     
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