Hardware spec - buying advice

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by ThomasJohansen, Mar 21, 2022.

  1. ThomasJohansen

    ThomasJohansen Registered

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    Think its time for an upgrade, but even though I work with IT, I cant keep up with technical stuff like with memory speed etc.

    Wanna stay in the AMD camp, but any opinions on these parts, or are the some better choices in this price range?

    • Ryzen 9 5900X
    • Kingston 32GB 3600mhz DDR4
    • Asus TUF A520M-plus motherboard.
    • and some water cooling.
    total around 850 Euro.

    Note:
    CPU benchmark says around 39000, which will be minimum 7x faster than my current cpu.
    I will continue on my GTX970 for a while.
    components will last for 4-5 years.
     
  2. davehenrie

    davehenrie Registered

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    Your system will be improved, but limited by the 4GB Vram on your GT970. Keep the details at a medium setting so you don't force the card to swap textures.
     
  3. ThomasJohansen

    ThomasJohansen Registered

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    @davehenrie I know the graphicscard is a bottleneck, but its gonna survive for a while, until prices normalize.

    My main problem I want to solve is stuttering AI when more than 10, problem with screen recording and slow simhub. When its overloaded it even have effect on my direct wheel.

    And my investment have to have a lifespan on 4-5 years.
     
  4. stonec

    stonec Registered

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    A 12-core CPU has no particular use for rF2 as AI runs single-threaded. The sim can offload some graphics tasks to other threads and OS can do some thread shuffling, but you still hit a limit quickly regarding how many threads a sim like rF2 can make practical use of. I guess depending on your other use those cores might come to use.

    RAM looks good. I would invest in a motherboard with a better chipset if you plan to buy a 500 € CPU. A520 is an entry-level chipset and shouldn't be ideally combined with the most power-hungry Ryzen out there. A520 is also limited to PCI-E 3.0 and typically those entry-level chipsets have poorer quality VRMs.
     
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  5. ThomasJohansen

    ThomasJohansen Registered

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    @stonec Thanks, it's exactly those infos I'm not up to date with. This gives me an idea of what to look for.
     
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  6. ThomasJohansen

    ThomasJohansen Registered

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    @stonec is it only AI that runs single threaded? Because when testing cpu use, rf2 uses all my cores.
     
  7. stonec

    stonec Registered

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    @ThomasJohansen Multi-threading is quite a complicated topic. If you look at things from Windows task manager, it shows usage for each CPU core, which is not the same as individual threads. Windows together with DX11 and drivers can do some magic and split the load even if your application is only coded to use one thread. So for example if you get the non-multithreaded instructions X-Y-Z in sequence, Windows likes to assign them to core 1, 2, 3 instead of running them all on core 1.

    This, however, does not give the same benefit as true multithreading. The app still cannot run these instructions independently, so it has to wait for core 1 to finish before core 2 can continue and finally core 3. Due to the microseconds or less of switching time between cores, in Windows task manager it looks like each core is simultaneously active whereas in reality they are necessarily not.

    Since I can't explain this any better, the short answer is to use a tool like Process Explorer to get actual thread usage (right click on rF2 process after game is started and go to Threads tab). This will show real threads the rF2 uses at any given time, not just the magic that Windows does with shuffling cores. When I last tested this about a year ago on my Ryzen 5 3600 (6C/6T CPU), rF2 showed the following:

    2-3 threads with moderate load, one with the highest
    3-5 ones with light load

    You can also get an idea of the use from Windows task manager obviously, but it won't be as accurate due to aforementioned magic shuffling. If you have a CPU with relatively few cores, it will probably look like rF2 is using them quite evenly. On my 6C/6T CPU, even Windows shows quite a few unused cores.

    And finally to the question you asked, yes, rF2 AI is still single threaded from everything I read on these forums, but Windows can obviously do the shuffling and get around some of it. It's really only the graphics part of rF2 that can efficiently use many threads.
     
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  8. ThomasJohansen

    ThomasJohansen Registered

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    @stonec thx again for the explanation. It's "funny" how 10-15 years lack in hardware-interest, have set me back in knowledge :)

    I'm trying to read up on it, and I can see a AM5 socket is around the corner, but not sure if I can wait that long.
    So maybe I should just lower the investment to about 550 euro and go for something like B550 & Ryzen 5 5600x & 32gb ram.

    Last question, do you think win10 will accept the move to new hardware without reinstall?
    I dont mind buying a new OEM key to get it registered again, they are cheap.
     
  9. Mitch9

    Mitch9 Registered

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    I think you need to re-activate windows every time you change hardware or re-install, but I´ve always been able to use my old key, no need to buy a new one
     
  10. ThomasJohansen

    ThomasJohansen Registered

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    Last time I bought a OEM key. costs about 12-20 euros.
    My concern is more boot failure, but found a couple of youtube videos and it looks like it probably will work.
     
  11. nolive721

    nolive721 Registered

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    @ThomasJohansen

    I strongly believe you should advise which resolution you are going to play the Game

    I am running RF2 on UW 1440p with a 6C/6T 3500X CPU and a 6600XT GPU and with frames much higher than 60fps butter smooth.

    the higher you go in resolution, the more the GPU would be your bottleneck so you should start from there, the GPU is that's the case so spending money here as prices are really going down now (I got my 6600XT few weeks ago for less than $500 new and its a beast of a card also in terms of efficiency).

    if you play at 1080p and want really high fps then your CPU could be the bottleneck but honestly a 6C/12T like 5600X would do the job well indeed.
    or a 3600 cheap so you have more budget and choice with upgrading the GPU as I mentioned above
     
  12. ThomasJohansen

    ThomasJohansen Registered

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    @nolive721
    i'm on a UW 1440p and frames are between 40-70fps with my current settings in game. I can live with this, even if I have to lower quality a bit with more AI's.
    Dont think I will go less than a 5600X.
    Buying a GPU for 700 Euro to only get double speed. I can wait a year to see if it gets to a normal level in near future.
    A 6600XT cost from 650 Euro in Denmark. A 6800XT cost 1150 euro.
     
  13. lordpantsington

    lordpantsington Registered

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    I skipped most replies, built a new pc last year: TUF x570, 5900X and 6800XT, 4x8 SR B-Die (Patriot Viper Steel, running underclocked 3800, 16-16-16-16-32-48). Maxed out @ 1080 is >300fps.
    Food for thought:
    The 5900X is definitely overkill for rf2, but you may have another use case that requires it. New socket is coming so there is no upgrade path forward. IF 1900 is hit or miss, especially on 2 CCD chips. You will be lucky if you can to push to 3800 CL14 1T, So spending extra for 'faster than that' DDR is just a bit of a flex. 3600 should just work though.
     
  14. stonec

    stonec Registered

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    B550 is a good starting point, it has all the basics in place. X570 is more for those into overclocking and tweaking etc.

    The Windows question is a tricky one. I read a lot of posts claiming you cannot do this, yet I switched an old Intel motherboard from 2013 into B450 in 2020 and Windows booted after loading some drivers for five minutes.

    This is not guaranteed to work, however, so I would strongly advice doing backups before that. You also most likely need to manually edit some BIOS settings to be compatible with old ones. Boot mode should be set to Legacy instead of UEFI if your old motherboard didn't already support UEFI and SATA mode should be set to match the one in your current configuration (IDE/AHCI).
     
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  15. davehenrie

    davehenrie Registered

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    The last time I did a major upgrade while not upgrading windows, I was turned down by the algorithm. But I appealed that and was granted continued use. I think it took a day or two for the reply.
     
  16. nolive721

    nolive721 Registered

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    Interesting demonstration


    But one clarification please

    you said you have 3600 Ryozen cpu and this one has SMT built in so 6cores and 12 threads

    my 3500x is only 6c 6t
     
  17. nolive721

    nolive721 Registered

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    Got it

    these GPU prices in Europe are still much higher than for me in Japan so I understand your point better now

    although 40 to 70fps on a UW 1440p like mine you must really tune down graphics settings to achieve that no?
     
  18. stonec

    stonec Registered

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    Interesting. I didn't even know there was a 3500X. Well, I would say 6C/6T is still enough for rF2 as rF2 is not as multi-threaded as other games. rF2 uses about eight threads on my 6C/12T CPU, but only three of them are in heavier use.
     
  19. ThomasJohansen

    ThomasJohansen Registered

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    Thanks for all your advices, really helpful.
    Bought following
    • Ryzen 5 5600X
    • MSI B550-a PRO
    • 32 GB G.skill DDR4 3200 C16
    Around 530 euro.
    GPU will be later on.

    Dont think I'll be messing with overclocking etc.
     
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  20. nolive721

    nolive721 Registered

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    yes I think the 3500X was mainly if not only sold over here in Asia and it was dirt cheap when I bought it back in the days

    I haven't found a CPU bounded scenario in the Games I play that could have justified to go for a 3600 or 3600X at the time since I was playing on 5760x1080 triple monitor setup, and now on UW 1440p, so those high resolution doesn't need as much CPU power.

    and yes I also noticed that RF2 is lightly threaded so no need for an upgrade for me
     

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